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SuperKooku

@superkooku / superkooku.tumblr.com

Greek mythology enjoyer A blog full of random fandoms (the list is getting bigger as I discover more fun books :3)
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Info post 3.0

Now I'll actually put some of the "highlights" on this blog. I'll add more in the future. I'll keep the tags of my interests so it's easier to know what I'm into.

Dionysus' iceberg : an essay on why this god is much more nuanced than in adaptations.

Maomao's family is awesome: Part 2 is in my drafts. I'll complete it one day... in the meantime, here's part 1 about Lakan and Luomen :

Translator adventures : me reading "Perseus' grandson" by Henry Lion Oldie, which is only available in Russian for now. And since I don't speak Russian, I'm kinda dependent on translators that don't 100% work 😂. I'm kinda summarizing the plot but mostly sharing my impressions of it. Here's the first reading :

My favorite mythological characters : in case someone asks me again :3

Question about retellings : this pin is more for myself and because of my mutuals' advice.

My Epic the musical fanfic (strictly Epic, don't use Odyssey tags please)

My other posts on "#not a reblog"

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Anonymous asked:

hahaha … wdym there’s shipping of Ariadne with Asterius …

When I read that, I reacted the same way you did anon.

YES! You read that completely right and there's not one but TWO books that ship Ariadne and Asterius. I wish I was kidding.

For the second one, @just-1-scorpio made a readthrough of it and I laughed the whole way through. I should read the last posts btw because I'm kinda curious but the commentary made it more fun to read than the actual book would be.

Honestly it's just as weird and cursed as you'd expect it to be.

Why tf would your ship Ariadne with her half-bull brother who didn't get any education and needs FAMILIAL love, not romance, instead of shipping her with the beautiful festive lovecraftian horror that is Dionysus. Her actual husband. You have the wild creature part (here an ethereal god) too without tainting what could be a beautifully bittersweet sibling relationship.

Give me my tragic doomed sibling bond back !!!

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margaretkart

The Labyrinth AU

Ariadne never expected to be stuck in the Labyrinth, let alone with a god who acted like it was his personal playground. Dionysus strolled in one day, charming ,draped in ivy, in front of her room as if he wasn't a stranger. But the real shock came when Asterion—her baby brother, barely a year old—giggled in her arms, and suddenly, his soft little head shifted into that of a bull. Just like that. No warning, no pain, just a blink and a snuffle through a now-broad snout. Ariadne nearly dropped him, but Dionysus? He just grinned, tracing the tiny horns with interest. “Now this is interesting,” he mused. “A prince of men and beasts alike.” And instead of seeing a curse, he cradled Asterion like a king in the making. Maybe, just maybe, the Labyrinth wasn’t a cage at all—but a throne room waiting for its rightful ruler.
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superkooku

Ok... so, the weird mythology crackship of the day will come from my blog. @sarafangirlart and @just-1-scorpio can catch a break.

Basically it comes from a french retelling of Atalanta (NGL the idea itself sounds good, she's very interesting and badass, but I'm always on my guard with this kind of projects)

I was like "ok, if it's good then at LEAST I can read it because it's in my mother tongue". So I was curious and checked out the summary...

BUT, here's the kicker, not only is Atalanta in this mess today but there's a surprise guest that I did NOT expect to show up in this kind of retellings 😅.

Here's the translated version:

Basically my reaction when Asclepius was mentioned :

Epione doesn't matter, I guess. Neither do the 10 kids she had with Asclepius.

Or the fact that Atalanta ALSO had other partners that aren't him. In fact she never even met him. Even in the Argonaut story, the only opportunity, there's not a source stating they're in there together.

Ares, Meleager and Hippomenes seeing their baddie getting shipped with someone other than them:

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Ok... so, the weird mythology crackship of the day will come from my blog. @sarafangirlart and @just-1-scorpio can catch a break.

Basically it comes from a french retelling of Atalanta (NGL the idea itself sounds good, she's very interesting and badass, but I'm always on my guard with this kind of projects)

I was like "ok, if it's good then at LEAST I can read it because it's in my mother tongue". So I was curious and checked out the summary...

BUT, here's the kicker, not only is Atalanta in this mess today but there's a surprise guest that I did NOT expect to show up in this kind of retellings 😅.

Here's the translated version:

Basically my reaction when Asclepius was mentioned :

Epione doesn't matter, I guess. Neither do the 10 kids she had with Asclepius.

Or the fact that Atalanta ALSO had other partners that aren't him. In fact she never even met him. Even in the Argonaut story, the only opportunity, there's not a source stating they're in there together.

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I have a genuine question: why do the adaptations hate healthy relationships in Greek mythology ?

It's so funny that so many of them try to crackship figures that never met each other, while ignoring wholesome couples like :

  • Hephaestus and Aglaia (no, "fixing" his marriage with Aphrodite doesn't work. Leave them alone)
  • Perseus and Andromeda
  • Hypnos and Pasithea
  • Admetus and Alcestis
  • Apollo and half of his lovers (Hyacinthus, Admetus, Cyrene, the Muses, heck even the lesser known ones like Thyia)
  • Poseidon and Nerites
  • Dionysus and Ariadne (I had to include them :3)
  • Asclepius and Epione
  • Philemon and Baucis
  • Hector and Andromache
  • Cadmus and Harmonia
  • Chiron and Chariclo
  • Eros and Psyche OF COURSE!
  • Artemis and... no, I'm kidding 😂
  • Aphrodite and whoever she wants. Let her have fun !!

And more ! Instead of shipping, idk, Medusa wirh Tiresias or Ariadne with fricking Asterius, how about we take a look at this list.

And don't get me started on the awesome platonic relationships that get sorely ignored !!

There's drama, there betrayal, there's some dark stuff in these stories, sure, but there's also some cuter stuff that deserves to be acknowledged.

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moonsun2010

Made an animatic summarising the entire book as a tribute to Dracula Daily and @re-dracula ! English subtitles provided, with translation by me and @ignitingthesky.

if you like this, do check out my kofi! there's a free pack of every single frame
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superkooku

To everyone who enjoyed reading Dracula : check out this animatic, it's so COOL !! Like a short film that summarizes the whole book.

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superkooku

I was doing some research on Phaedra and stumbled on this gem. After clicking on the research, I was relieved to realize this isn't about Apollo and Phaedra from mythology but two real-life people. The guy is named Apollo Nida and a woman Phaedra Park. I know nothing about these two btw so the details won't be explained.

But now I'm imagining Phaedra somehow having a thing with Apollo, marrying him, then divorce and be married to Theseus afterwards and THEN fall in love with her stepson. As if Phaedra's love life wasn't already a trainwreck.

Or maybe she thought "If my sister can handle marrying an Olympian god, then so can I >:3" before realizing she can't or smth. With Apollo being confused the whole time. Yet another love story that ends up badly for him...

Going from Apollo to Theseus would be a big downgrade but then again, Coronis DID choose to cheat on this gorgeous deity with Ischys who seems remarkably unremarkable so maybe it could've happened. Even though she did seem to want him, contrary to Daphne or Bolina, so she just made a stupid choice.

(note that ofc there is absolutely zero source neither Greek nor Latin even slightly hinting at anything between these two and it's just me making a joke post about an impossible crackship.)

This is such a cursed crackship like,,, I don't even mean that insultingly, I'm just thinking about it as a concept and I'm laughing cause like, okay listen;

Firstly, the idea of Apollo's whole 'never marrying anyone ever' thing being broken - not by any of his consorts, lovers or baby mothers - but by a woman in the line of Helios, specifically from Pasiphae's cursed line, is objectively hilarious. That's just made even funnier with the thought that Apollo's singular, sole marriage somehow still ends in a divorce for a HUMAN -- and not just ANY human either, the mortal man who just waged war against his sister's beloved Amazons and who assaulted and ultimately led to the death of specifically her beloved Hippolyta in that war.

And then, somehow, by some streak of divine providence, neither Apollo nor Artemis vaporises her for that madness, Phaedra ends up falling in love with Hippolyta's only begotten son who Artemis also adores with all her heart leading to what has to be the strangest love triangle of all time where Artemis and Hippolytus love each other platonically while Phaedra just torments herself over her forbidden lust of her stepson (who is also her ex-husband's sister's current favourite mortal and hunting partner!!)

Keep in mind btw, Apollo is one of the gods Theseus respects and actively worships. Like, I'm just reminding the court how interconnected this whole thing is at this point - Theseus is literally credited with the mythical creation of one of The Attic Culture Festivals, specifically Pyanopsia which is not only a major agricultural festival but also got started because Theseus promised Apollo he would give him a bomb dot com offering if he pretty please made sure the Minotaur didn't crush his bones into dust and upon miraculously surviving, he made the world's best bean stew and offered it to the god. Y'know,,, the Minotaur? Phaedra's little brother the Minotaur?? The one whose death she now complicitly celebrates by eating bean stew every pyanepsion with the rest of Athens?

Then, to top ALL of that off, somehow, it STILL takes HIPPOLYTUS BEING AROACE to insult Aphrodite which leads to her cursing Phaedra like Poseidon cursed Pasiphae by intensifying the lust she held for Hippolytus while Theseus is away for Phaedra to actually make a move on Hippolytus which makes him insult her so badly that she kills herself.

All of that. All of that divine entanglement and drama and Phaedra still ends up dying because her stepson called her an incestuous creep.

This timeline is absolutely insane 😂. I knew it was from the start but your points really just highlighted everything funny and wrong with this whole idea.

Imagine how family dinners would look like, though. Even without the whole Phaedra and Apollo crackship, it'd be horribly cursed and I think Theseus would want to jump out the window. But if we add THEM into the mix, it's so funny.

  • Theseus
  • His wife Phaedra
  • His son Hippolytus who Phaedra fell in love with
  • His wife's father and political enemy Minos
  • His wife's mother and daughter of Helios Pasiphae
  • Theseus' ex and Phaedra's sister Ariadne
  • An Olympian god and his ex's husband Dionysus
  • And if we add Apollo, we have his wife's ex AND his ex fiance's husband's half-brother who's also an Olympian god
  • Theseus and Phaedra's kids
  • Dionysus and Ariadne's kids
  • The ghosts of Ariadne and Phaedra's brothers (including the Minotaur lol). Plus the ghost of Aegeus
  • Let's just bring Artemis at that point, as if there weren't enough gods. Because Hippolytus really needs the emotional support at this point.
  • Or Zeus because he's basically connected to everyone in this mess except Pasiphae.

And then the possibility that they had kids 😅. Yes, because if the situation isn't cursed enough, imagine if Phaedra and Apollo had kids.

Also, Apollo's only marriage being THIS mess is the cherry on top.

So much rambling for an impossible crackship, I love it !

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I was doing some research on Phaedra and stumbled on this gem. After clicking on the research, I was relieved to realize this isn't about Apollo and Phaedra from mythology but two real-life people. The guy is named Apollo Nida and a woman Phaedra Park. I know nothing about these two btw so the details won't be explained.

But now I'm imagining Phaedra somehow having a thing with Apollo, marrying him, then divorce and be married to Theseus afterwards and THEN fall in love with her stepson. As if Phaedra's love life wasn't already a trainwreck.

Or maybe she thought "If my sister can handle marrying an Olympian god, then so can I >:3" before realizing she can't or smth. With Apollo being confused the whole time. Yet another love story that ends up badly for him...

Going from Apollo to Theseus would be a big downgrade but then again, Coronis DID choose to cheat on this gorgeous deity with Ischys who seems remarkably unremarkable so maybe it could've happened. Even though she did seem to want him, contrary to Daphne or Bolina, so she just made a stupid choice.

(note that ofc there is absolutely zero source neither Greek nor Latin even slightly hinting at anything between these two and it's just me making a joke post about an impossible crackship.)

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reblogged

I have the feeling that retelling writers no longer read the source matterial, at least when it comes to Greek mythology, specificly Medusa and Persephone and Hades retellings.

Search Persephone and Hades retellings on Goodreads, or Amazon, and look at the discription, book covers, and if you want you can look fourther and look at the advertaisment.

Similarly with Medusa retellings.

It just feels like, because of how many of it are there, it just feels as if the retellings canibalise each other. And usually when one stands out, it's because of the wrong reasons.

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superkooku

It's actually so true 😅. How many HxP retellings have the same tired plot structure that's either the cliche BookTok stuff or straight up pulled from Lore Olympus?

And the trend of retellings taking place in the USA reeks of reading PJO as a kid but nothing else.

(again, I have nothing against fans of either franchise. But just be honest and tell you're retelling these two popular adaptations and not the real stories).

Also, I noticed it's often the same few myths that get retold with the same inaccurate structure over and over again while a lot of very interesting stories are ignored.

The same few myths being Hades and Persephone, some variation of Ovid Medusa, OOC Aphrodite and Hephaestus, etc...

This goes hand in hand with OP's cannibalism analogy that I find very funny.

Because these ignored myths aren't in this cycle of being constantly retold and people would need to read the source material to understand the nuances. Btw I refer to popular myths that we all heard about but don't see explored in depth, not some obscure story that's hidden in a sentence of some scholiast's analysis.

Of course, at this point, a lot of stories and especially romance myths have at least one extremely inaccurate version (and I'm not even mentioning crackships) but there are some that always come back.

Not that the popular myths are treated any better, but yeah 😅.

All I can hope for is that stuff like Eros and Psyche or Dionysus and Ariadne's story don't get turned into the first category.

(especially since adaptations seem unable to understand their characters).

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Anonymous asked:

Since I have noticed you're an Asterion defender, may I suggest you watch "Icare" 2022? It's a French animated movie which focuses on the possibility that the Minotaur was originally a gentle soul and was corrupted by King Minos' harsh treatment. It's beautifully animated and the design of Minotaur is simply epic (seriously, just google images for him).

Maybe the one thing you may dislike about the movie is the portrayal of Ariadne. She's depicted as a total bitch and a jerkass spoiled princess who hates the Minotaur as much as everyone else (sorry, no sibling empathy between the two) and cares only about herself. Oh, and her being abandoned in Naxos is mostly treated less of a nasty move by Theseus and more of her getting her comeuppance. Oh, and there's no Dionysus to save her.

Very interesting ask, anon ! And I'm kinda glad you took the time to read through some of my posts :3. I heard of this movie and kinda forgot about it.

As you guess, this summary leaves me in a very ambiguous position.

I'll start by analyzing each element separately.

Asterius (and other positives)

Quite frankly, seeing him as a straight up pacifist doesn't fit the myths. Since he did kill and eat these people.

However, it's the circumstances that make me sympathize for him, as he was thrown in the Labyrinth by an uncaring "father figure"

The description you gave doesn't go too far in the former direction and is actually very interesting to explore ! Asterius having a naive soul due to him not being tainted by the outside world and ultimately no bad intentions but just wild instinct and rage at his loneliness.

And I kinda like the Minotaur's design here, ngl. He looks kinda human, not like a demon from Berserk or a guy in armor. If anything, he gives me Ghibli monster vibes. I dig it !!

He has these childish vibes that definitely fit his secluded lifestyle and potentially hope (that would unfortunately be in vain)

Seeing Icarus build a friendship with him is actually a very cute idea and the potential for a bittersweet movie.

And the artstyle is absolutely adorable btw :3

Ariadne :(

Thanks for the trigger warning 🤣. I feel like this is the exact opposite problem with Jennifer Saint's version but that has the same effect.

Instead of being a passive doormat in one retelling, this Ariadne sounds like a typical pick-me-girl who doesn't respect her promises. And she's spoiled 😮‍💨. In the end, she's stripped of all her qualities and demonized.

She sounds exactly like the kind of character I dislike. Not that I hate them because they're despicable, like a well-written villain, but rather annoying nuisances on screen, wasting my time, and if I didn't love her mythical counterpart so much, I'd say she'd deserve to end up alone on that island. (Sorry but I came across this type of character before and they never fail to aggravate me).

Listen, I see a way we could alter this so it works. Maybe we could show Ariadne resigning herself to see Asterius die not because she hates him or finds him disgusting but because he suffers too much and is beyond saving (at least as long as other lives are on the line).

Probably dedicating a scene where she says farewell to him and maybe Icarus' more idealistic perspective could be confronted to her knowing Asterius better and how Minos mishandled him.

Betraying her half-brother could be a very dramatic and bittersweet plot point that could leave a lot of scars in her psyche.

It's a shame that she's characterized like that because I like her design, she looks cute and idk, her hair being red wine is a tiny detail that looks cool (if she's the ginger girl in the cover).

Also, imagine Ariadne, Icarus AND Asterius being secret buddies or something. A tragic friendship.

Fortunately, I get to regularly enjoy some good Ariadne stuff on @margaretkart 's blog (and more sporadically from other artists, dw).

Because adaptation-wise, there aren't that many interesting portrayals of her other than the sources and maybe the Roberta Gellis book that I WILL get to one day.

(I'd take an interesting adaptation of her character even without Dionysus and stuff. Just something of substance for her would be great)

The rest

EXCEPT for Ariadne being ruined, I'm curious about how others are shown. Icarus seems to be a cute kid. But how about Minos ? He'll have a seemingly negative portrayal, which tbf fits this story.

But I wonder if Pasiphae will be any better. Or Phaedra will maybe be more complex than her sister if she appears at all.

Hopefully Daedalus will have an interesting role.

I also wonder why Theseus abandons her in this version though. Because he hates her or just because he forgets ? Or how Theseus is portrayed in general.

As a hero, as a jerk, or as the massive airhead he is in mythology?

I may check out this movie one day and write a review post.

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Pasiphae. Semele. Medusa. Now a hundred grieving mothers. The price we paid for the resentment, the lust, and the greed of arrogant men was our pain, shining and bright like the blad of a newly honed knife. Dionysus had once seemed to me the best of them all, but I saw him now for waht he was, no different from the mightiest of the gods. Or the basest men.

From Ariadne by Jennifer Saint

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margaretkart

This passage from Jennifer Saint’s Ariadne exemplifies many of the ways modern Greek myth retellings distort the original myths, often imposing contemporary narratives of suffering and victimhood onto characters and stories that do not align with them.

First, the inclusion of Medusa in Ariadne’s lament is historically and thematically jarring. Medusa’s myth has no direct connection to Ariadne, Pasiphae, or Semele. While modern interpretations often frame Medusa as a victim of divine cruelty, her story belongs to a completely separate lineage of myth. Ariadne, the princess of Crete, abandoned by Theseus and later embraced by Dionysus, would have no reason to invoke Medusa’s fate alongside her own. This forced grouping suggests an attempt to create a broad “sisterhood of suffering” among female figures in mythology, even when their stories do not naturally intersect.

More egregiously, the passage distorts Ariadne’s relationship with Dionysus. Classical sources portray their union as one of love, celebration, and even divine joy. Unlike the tragic relationships of other mortal women with gods—such as Semele’s fiery demise due to Hera’s trickery—Ariadne’s marriage to Dionysus is one of the few happy endings in Greek mythology. Far from being deceived or discarded, she is crowned a goddess, her love returned in full measure. The idea that she would see Dionysus as no different from the "mightiest of the gods" or "the basest men" completely contradicts the reverence and devotion their myth traditionally conveys. If anything, Dionysus is often portrayed as an outsider among the Olympians, more sympathetic to mortals, women, and the marginalized than gods like Zeus or Poseidon.

The thematic distortion in this passage stems from a broader trend in modern myth retellings: the need to retrofit Greek myths into a framework of oppression and suffering that fits modern sensibilities but erases the cultural and religious context of the original stories. Greek myths were not morality tales in the modern sense, nor were they simple narratives of victimhood. They explored power, fate, love, and transformation in ways that were complex and often paradoxical. By reducing them to a narrative of female pain inflicted by male arrogance, retellings like this one strip the myths of their depth and uniqueness, flattening their characters into archetypes that suit a contemporary agenda rather than reflecting the original stories.

Ultimately, this passage misrepresents not only Ariadne and Dionysus but also the very nature of Greek mythology. It replaces mythic nuance with a one-size-fits-all feminist tragedy that, ironically, removes the agency and joy from characters who originally had them.

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superkooku

I read the book a while ago and remember liking the beginning but being sorely disappointed by the second half for precisely this reason (and Ariadne being way too passive because women suffer all the time and don't do anything else).

She's not involved in Dionysus' cult, she doesn't meet any other mythological creature or figure, barely interacts with maenads, etc. Kinda ironic that the "feminist" retelling chooses to depict her in such a way. Maybe to highlight how much of a victim women are to evil men or idk what. Making Ariadne a doormat doesn't give justice to the myth version.

And this is too bad because this retelling had the potential to be great. It had all the building bricks : a chronological story of Ariadne's life, her relationship with her family especially Phaedra, Dionysus, the kids, even the myth of the war against Perseus!

But ultimately, it fails in the execution department, specifically with the themes and the link with mythology like @margaretkart explained.

The ending is also very weirdly placed considering Ariadne dies, iirc like in the myth where she's turned to stone (I don't exactly remember the ending of the book so correct me if I'm wrong) and... that's it. Whereas in the myths, Dionysus resurrects her and makes her a goddess. But hey, why should we show him being a good husband when we can have more scenes of Ariadne lamenting her fate ?

To me, Dionysus and Ariadne have to match each other's freak. You know what I mean ? They're in-synch, gossiping together and ready to fight alongside each other.

The few versions where Ariadne has an unhappy ending because of him are SEPARATE form the versions where they meet and marry each other (most notably Homer's). So it's just treated as some divine punishment.

Listen, I'd be super hypocritical if I suddenly asked adaptations to portray Dionysus as soft and meek. Because he's not. He's 50% a party animal and 50% a lovecraftian menace to society. BUUUUT, he's soft towards Ariadne and if I see someone like Pentheus describing him in a terrible way and being terrified, she would never do that.

Portraying conflict in their marriage is fine, even showing her being overwhelmed and having abandonment issues is ok, but Dionysus should always strive to support her and again, they have a happy marriage and I'm not open on discussion about this last statement.

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