User talk:SatyrTN/Archive 6

This is an archive of past discussions with User:SatyrTN. Do not edit the contents of this page. If you wish to start a new discussion or revive an old one, please do so on the current talk page.

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Archive 10

Hi, the RfD closed in favour of redirecting the Wikipedia:Esperanza links. If your still will to get Satyrbot to fix the links could you file a request for approval at Wikipedia:Bots/Requests for approval? Cheers, WjBscribe 19:55, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

Never mind, another Bot has now been approved to perform this task. WjBscribe 20:12, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Can you send out a group wide message about the upcoming elections? I don't think we've advertised very well. :( Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:43, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

Just to let you know that to give more people a chance to run, I have extended the deadline for nominations until May 5. The election will the run for one week. WjBscribe 19:28, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

Is the bot supposed to be add the WikiProject Chicago tag to articles which aren't related to Chicago? For example, WrestleMania 13 took place in Rosemont, Illinois (a suberb of Chicago, but not actually part of Chicago). Is it meant to mean Chicagoland, not just Chicago? TJ Spyke 05:10, 30 April 2007 (UTC)

I too wonder about the accuracy of your bot. It tagged the Jon Corzine article as being part of the Chicago project, even though the only links he has to the area are a University of Chicago degree and the fact that he once worked in a Chicago bank. This hardly seems like enough justification for inclusion in the project (unless you are intending to include all UC graduates who have wiki articles, that is). A response in the appropriate section of the Jon Corzine discussion page would be appreciated. -Grammaticus Repairo 19:12, 1 May 2007 (UTC)

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter - SPECIAL ELECTION EDITION

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter! Issue VI - May 2, 2007 Monthly Challenge: Stand for Deputy Coordinator or support some candidates after May 5... Article News Cowboys Are Frequently, Secretly Fond of Each Other is a Featured Article Candidate. Project News A taskforce dealing with LGBT publications has been proposed. If you are interested in getting involved, consider signing up at the projects' page. Our core topics list is looking good. It's still a bit slim on LGBT history articles, non-American LGBT media, and important LGBT biographies. Do you have suggestions? David Shankbone has done an amazing job taking photographs of LGBT celebrities. Thanks David! People interested in collaborating with him and setting up a photography taskforce should contact him or drop a note at the project's talkpage. The LGBT Portal still needs a bit of love and attention :-). Again, any good quality (free) photos you come across on LGBT articles can be added to the gallery here. Volunteers to help out with the Portal are extremely welcome- make yourselves known on the Portal's talkpage. Updates to the current news items are helpful. Deputy coordinator elections WikiProject LGBT studies is looking for new Deputy Coordinators to help out with various essential tasks in organising the project. To nominate yourself or contribute to the discussion, please go to: Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies/Coordinator/May 2007. The deadline for nominations is May 5 and the elections will last a week after that. Candidates so far are: SatyrTN, Raystorm and Fireplace. The elections will be pretty simple- everyone just endorses their favourite candidate(s). The three with the most votes at the end of the week are the new deputy coordinators, who will assist Dev920 in keeping the project running. Member News Our membership continues to expand. 22 new users have joined the WikiProject (bringing our total membership to 182): Zigzig20s, Qxmagazine, TAnthony, Kbolino, Knorpel, Madman bum and angel, Ponyboy, BenjiBoi, Guy M, Pernishus, Rockdozen, RAShippy, Jaibe, Fshepinc, rglong, Boomboomeve, Undertheinfluence, Kyoko, Catsaki, OsteopathicFreak, smccoy12345, and Alexlovesme. Also Rebecca who rejoins us having previously been a member as Ambi. Please make them feel welcome! To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, just ask Dev920. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, do let her know.

This month's project newsletter (hand delivered as SatyrTN and Dev920 are away). Best wishes, WjBscribe 03:09, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

That is a rather unpleasant account of the incident. I seem to recall that a) your bot was not authorised to amend article pages and b) it was established that Andy Mabbett was acting without consensus, and the consensus which developed as a result of the incident was clearly in favour of tagging talk pages only. See also WP:NPA --Tagishsimon (talk) 11:24, May 3 2007 (UTC)

and there are questions for you to answer at Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies/Coordinator/May 2007. Thanks for volunteering! =) ··coelacan 03:06, 6 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks a lot for your efforts on behalf of WP:WPChi. You have saved us so much work. I have revised my WP:BOTREQ request a bit. It now has 5 parts (see here). Which of these 5 can SatyrBot do? Set it up to do any and all that it can do. I placed the request based on the impression from our discourse that these were not request that you would place a high priority on. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 18:06, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I commend you on not blindly adding the Category:Chicago railroads. I noticed they were omitted and you are correct. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 18:19, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I did not know you used a batch system. I thought you were done. What percentage of the categories have you done? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 21:18, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

Roughly 45% done. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:20, 26 April 2007 (UTC)

I am going to add several categories from Category:Cook County, Illinois to our request. The categories are listed at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Chicago/Categories#Cook County. Doing this adds several important neighboring towns and more importantly many important articles and subcategories including Hillary Rodham Clinton and Category:People from Oak Park, Illinois. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 20:51, 27 April 2007 (UTC)

I am going to be looking at the Category:Chicago railroads subcats. I will do many by hand. However, I think I will add some for the bot. Let me know when the bot will start back up. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 16:04, 5 May 2007 (UTC)

I see you are back today because you have changed the current project. Will you be adding a new set of categories today? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 14:55, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Only on briefly today. Will be back tomorrow and can catch up on anything that needs to be completed. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:02, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the help so far. See you tomorrow. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 18:52, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. I was thinking that after the first pass through the categories we might set up 7 lists and have the bot once a week check each for updates. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 15:07, 7 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I noticed that in March 2007, SatyrBot tagged several WikiProjects as "inactive". However, in at least two cases, it seems to have tagged pages that were non-existent (i.e., it created the pages and immediately tagged them as inactive). The pages are Wikipedia:WikiProject R and Wikipedia:WikiProject The Naked Brothers Band. I just thought I'd let you know so you could try to figure out what was going on. Cheers, Black Falcon ^(Talk) 23:21, 29 April 2007 (UTC)

The same is true of Wikipedia:WikiProject Biophysics and Wikipedia:WikiProject Pak-Afghan Relations. -- Black Falcon ^(Talk) 19:59, 2 May 2007 (UTC)

Also the following: Wikipedia:WikiProject Drake, Wikipedia:WikiProject Forensics, Wikipedia:WikiProject Surgery, Wikipedia:WikiProject Physiology, Wikipedia:WikiProject Orthopedics, Wikipedia:WikiProject Otolarngology, Wikipedia:WikiProject Otolarngology, and Wikipedia:WikiProject Newfoundland. -- Black Falcon ^(Talk) 05:07, 3 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Black Falcon! Sorry to be so late getting back to you. I've adjusted SatyrBot to account for whether or not the page exists before tagging it with the "inactive" category. Thanks for pointing that out! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:37, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Hiya :) - I removed Margaret Cho from the articles needing wikification list but the bot added it back. Is this a one off thing or is intervention needed from you? :P Of course if you think it still needs the wikification tag, feel free to add it back. Mentality 22:33, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

The bot is looking for the cleanup tags, and Margaret Cho still has a {{wikify}} tag on her page, so it's including it. If the wikify tag is removed, she won't show up on the list anymore. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:38, 11 May 2007 (UTC)

Ah, I didn't notice that there was a wikify tag on the Notes section too, I only removed it from the top of the article. Sorry! Mentality 13:50, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

NP - glad to help :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:51, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

Among other things... :-) Raystorm 16:11, 13 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello! Thanks for all your help. I was working on a project about the market power of the GLBT community and found I was citing that organization quite a bit and realized many friends didn't know too much about, so I created a page for it and linked it to the Gay market page. Baby steps for me. Now I'm going to make a few pages about the HIV epidemic in DC. Wish me luck and thanks for your kindness :) Kminiter 21:05, 2007 May 14

Hey SatyrTN! I agree with most of your removals. As I was posting them I decided to err on the side of inclusion, but reading your reasoning I see the ones you excluded are valid.

But some of the ones you removed I think still warrant inclusion. Is there a way we could vote on them? The ones I think are still relevant are:

• Asexuality - because there is debate about whether it is a valid sexual identity and should be included within LGBT as LGBTA
• Family Research Council - because its the sister organization of Focus on the Family founded by the same guy for the same purpose; they should really either both be out of the scope or both be within the scope of the Project.
• McCarthyism - because of the systematic firing of gay federal employees see Lavender Scare or the GLBTQ Encyclopedia

Peace! Queerudite 03:04, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I didn't realize intersex wasn't included -- that seems unfortunate. But in regards to McCarthyism, I feel like even though gays weren't the primary targets, they were targeted; the same rationale for why we include the Holocaust in the LGBT Project, I presume. Queerudite 04:05, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Eh - go for it :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:10, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I saw you rated the article GAY to Z and I'm wondering if it didn't cross your mind that it should be processed for deletion. It pretty clearly fails notability guidelines for WP:WEB and I could very easily make the case for Speedy:Blatant Advertising, given it appears to have been created by the site owners themselves. Is there any reason it shouldn't be tagged for speedy or nominated for AfD? AUTiger ʃ ^talk/_work 16:55, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the feedback; I was just double-checking in case it was a site that was somehow "culturally significant" that I might not be aware of. AUTiger ʃ ^talk/_work 17:07, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

Welcome back- you were missed (not least by Coelacan and I who had to deliver the signpost manually...).

The LGBT Wikiproject as endorsed you as an assistant coordinator. Thanks for volunteering to help out in this capacity. As you are aware Dev is going to be away for the near future given her real life commitments (exams etc) so it falls to you and Fireplace to take over the running of the show... I remain around should either of you have questions or need help. Best of luck, WjBscribe 11:37, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

And as you figure out how to work this crazy deal, do update Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies/Coordinator to at least an informative status (I wasn't real clear on what y'all are to be doing, so that's open-ended for you to decipher. =) Hit me directly on my talk page when you need grunt work or a sounding board. ··coelacan 11:48, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello, SatyrTN. An automated process has found and removed an image or media file tagged as nonfree media, and thus is being used under fair use that was in your userspace. The image (Image:Center Harbor Town Seal.gif) was found at the following location: User:SatyrTN/Gallery. This image or media was attempted to be removed per criterion number 9 of our non-free content policy. The image or media was replaced with Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg , so your formatting of your userpage should be fine. Please find a free image or media to replace it with, and or remove the image from your userspace. User:Gnome (Bot)-talk 20:05, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello, SatyrTN. An automated process has found and removed an image or media file tagged as nonfree media, and thus is being used under fair use that was in your userspace. The image (Image:Hampton, NH Seal.gif) was found at the following location: User:SatyrTN/Gallery. This image or media was attempted to be removed per criterion number 9 of our non-free content policy. The image or media was replaced with Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg , so your formatting of your userpage should be fine. Please find a free image or media to replace it with, and or remove the image from your userspace. User:Gnome (Bot)-talk 07:05, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

I am currently in extended debate about {{ChicagoWikiProject}} usage. However, it involves only 1 of the 7000 + pages your bot has tagged. I can deal with a 1 per 7000 problem ratio. Therefore, I would say go ahead with Cook County and other pages unless otherwise instructed. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 14:10, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Are we missing a report or two User:SatyrBot/Project_list#WikiProject_Chicago here? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio) 14:12, 12 May 2007 (UTC)

P.S. Thanks for updating the reports. I noticed that you did not yet do the 2 stub categories and the list of late additions. I am not sure if you over looked them. Keep up the good work. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 18:49, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I did miss those - sorry about that! I'll run them tonight.

You also mentioned running a check every night of 1/7th of the categories. The bot currently runs a similar task weekly for WP:LGBT, so I can modify that script to run on both projects.

For LGBT, I have it compile a list of pages that have recently been added to LGBT categories but don't yet have a banner. Instead of automatically adding the banner, I have it create the list at Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies/Cat Search 4 New Pages. The reason being that about a quarter of the time someone has added an LGBT cat to an article as a form of vandalism, so we manually check each new entry.

Would you prefer a similar compilation that would then be checked by a member of WP:Chi? Or would you prefer to just add the banner? Besides the possibility of spam (which is probably pretty low in the case of your project), another concern would be "exception" articles - those that might be in a related category, but for one reason or another, shouldn't belong to the project. The bot really has no way of determining those articles, though I suppose we could add a hidden comment to the talk page to stop it.

Let me know what you think. SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 19:55, 14 May 2007 (UTC)

I think that by the nature of the category Chicago is less inclined to vandalism than LGBT. I think you could just add the banner. Did you see the late addition categories. I don't see them on your next run list. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 14:10, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Which latest categories? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:25, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I guess I was tagging some Anne Rice novels at the time; Henry in Mummy is gay but at the time there was no Category:Literature with LGBT characters. I'm of the mind that any LGBT content should be somehow noted for navigation/organizational purposes. But obviously the book doesn't need to be part of the Project, I made the fixes.

By the way, I didn't move any items into the Verification section of the Cat Search page because I assumed the bot would do it based on the tags, and that they would also come up on the Project's To Do list. If that's not the case, please let me know, I'd hate to be creating more work for ya. TAnthony 14:27, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Hmm, why isn't the To Do List bot picking up the items in your Category:LGBT articles with unsourced categories? Doing so may widen the pool of people pitching in. I know these are probably higher priority items, so if you're worried about them getting lost in the Verification section you can split them out in their own section. Just an idea. ;) TAnthony 16:05, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

That's a good idea - don't know when I'll add that code, but that seems like a good thing to add.

A couple minor points: a) The bot only runs once a week on this task, so I didn't have it looking for articles to re-verify. b) I noticed you're using the generic {{unsourced}} (though I had no idea you could add the reason like that). I created the template {{Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies/Category unsourced}} mostly because I wanted the unsourced statement to also put the article in Category:LGBT articles with unsourced categories - the generic one just puts it in Category:All articles lacking sources. Not a big deal. c) Thanks for chomping through the list! It just grows every week, but it's good to get it so small! Thanks! And why didn't you sign up to be a coordinator? You wield a mop well! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:05, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, I started using the {{unsourced}} template before I realized you'd created one; I like it because it obviously makes the articles come up in the To Do list, but it doesn't add the Category:LGBT articles with unsourced categories, which would be nice. You can totally change or add to the reason as long as the first word is "section" or "article" since that's how it's designed; I've been meaning to see about adding "category" but there may be a reason someone hasn't already.

By the way, I'm not lazy about classifying articles I tag, I just don't trust my judgment if an article isn't an obvious stub (though I'll sometimes rate Starts). And I think I might have tagged a few unsourced articles with the banner because the subjects were dead; didn't think they'd mind, LOL.

I thought about being a coordinator but I really never know when and if I'll have time to do anything; if at least three decent-sounding people hadn't submitted themselves, I would have. TAnthony 18:54, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Ah, OK, I just realized that the To Do List bot is of course only pulling in items already tagged into the project, which the unsourced articles shouldn't necessarily be — so my using the generic template is useless, the bulk of items won't come up on the To Do list after all. So I'll start using your template for people whose sexuality needs sourcing, since that'll separate them out for people in the Project who may actually do the work! TAnthony 20:29, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

That's kewl. Though unsourced people have their own list: Wikipedia:List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people/To be sorted. That list was generated once and probably won't be again (well, maybe). So maybe we need a better way to figure out a) which LGBT articles are people, and b) which LGBT people are unsourced. Thoughts? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:50, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Greetings! I note that in this diff you removed the LGBT project banner from the talk page for the article on Justin Berry. Were the story strictly one of pederasty, I would agree with your removal, even though the banner - in modified form - appears on the NAMBLA talk page. From my perspective, since the story involves both legally underage & legally of-age male-male sexuality, I feel that it meets the criteria for inclusion in the project. I'm posting the same message on my Talk page, and I invite you to enter into a dialogue there. --Ssbohio 14:12, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi SatyrTN, thanks for adding the nesting code to {{LabourProject}}. I like how compact it makes a busy page look. Cheers.--Bookandcoffee 20:15, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello, SatyrTN. An automated process has found and will an image or media file tagged as nonfree media, and thus is being used under fair use that is in your userspace. The image (Image:Manchester City Seal.png) was found at the following location: User:SatyrTN/Gallery. This image or media will be removed per criterion number 9 of our non-free content policy. The image or media will be replaced with Image:NonFreeImageRemoved.svg , so your formatting of your userpage should be fine. This does not necessarily mean that the image is being deleted, or that the image is being removed from other pages. It is only being removed from the page mentioned above. All mainspace instances of this image will not be affected Please find a free image or media to replace it with, and or remove the image from your userspace. User:Gnome (Bot)-talk 20:32, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

I added some items to Wikipedia talk:WikiProject LGBT studies/to do and actually moved the "Please" phrase from Wikipedia talk:WikiProject LGBT studies/to do short list with it for placement, but I'm not sure if the edits will remain or if the bot will refresh it all. I wanted to add your Cat search and the AlexNewArtBot results to a place where Project members could note them and participate (the Talk page will get archived soon enough).

PS - Don't know what NPOV Transgender issue to which you are referring? TAnthony 22:34, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

Oh! Sorry - that was Queerudite, not you. I'll let hir know.

I've adjusted the bot to put the short list on the short list page without any additional text.

Thanks, by the way, for all your work! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 00:31, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Glad to be of service when I can! Which reminds me, I just noticed that the third coordinator dropped out; please feel free to delegate tasks/keep me in the loop if you need any help. TAnthony 01:44, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

I've updated the bot so it's not "Pease"-ing :) And the NPOV issue with Transgender probably should be put on the WT:LGBT page, since the bot won't include that when it runs again. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:23, 16 May 2007 (UTC)

BTW, the bot takes the "requested articles" directly from Wikipedia:Requested articles/Social sciences and philosophy. So rather than adding them back in after each daily update, you could add them to WP:RA once and be done :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:42, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I know, but that "main" article has decriptive bits and article links that don't come through with the bot; I won't add them all the time, but thought it might help/encourage people to start the articles. TAnthony 16:16, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi there,

I added an LGBT category for Simon Woods but you removed it saying that it wasn't sourced in the article. Sorry, I did write something on the talkpage giving a link to the source but wasn't sure how to source a category addition (if this makes sense). Would you be able to point me in the right direction for how to do this and I'll happily make the changes myself. Unless. of course, you disagreed with the categorisation itself in which case I was just wondering if the source I had given wasn't reliable enough.

Kind regards. Intesvensk 20:16, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I'm pretty sure the gossip column from The Independent doesn't count as a reliable source. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:16, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi there (sorry about putting the comment in the wrong place), Pandora isn't really a gossip column (well it isn't at all in fact). The Independent is a broadsheet and doesn't have a gossip column. Do you still want something else? Kind regards Intesvensk 21:43, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I did a quick and not very thorough search through Google and at the Advocate. All I found was that article and a couple blogs referring to that article. If there were another source, I'd feel much better about including the information - we do have to be careful about biographies of living people. Thanks for being thorough! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:47, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I'll have a look. To be honest, it's hardly like it's the one thing keeping the article from FA status. If I find it I'll put it in, if not then he'll just have to remain straight :) Take care. Intesvensk

ROTFL!!!! Thanks for a smile :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:06, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Surprise! You're on ANI. WP:ANI#Aggressive edits by SatyrBot. I've closed the thread (hopefully) as it's not an admin-intervention kind of thing. But somebody's bugged enough to come running there. I dunno. Read the thread, read the older thread that it links to (I don't know if anyone told you there was an earlier ANI thread that amounted to chatter?). Don't reply on ANI; it was the wrong venue for the complaint so traffic there is unnecessary. ··coelacan 00:36, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks - I've contacted that user. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:51, 19 May 2007 (UTC)

I hereby unto giveth the first Chicago Barnstar:

TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 19:46, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Awww! <blush> Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:51, 15 May 2007 (UTC)

Now that I am getting the hang of using this let me do it right

		The Chicago WikiProject Barnstar
		For outstanding service in the oversight of category selection and in the use bot programming for {{ChicagoWikiProject}} tagging? -- TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 04:14, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Nice - that'll look good in my Barnstar Gallery! Tyvm! -- SatyrTN 00:24, 2007 May 20

Thank you for all your help in maintaining the 'To do list' and tagging the project banner to articles. However I have noticed the automated list of requested articles tends to be a list of musicians and misses all the articles listed here Wikipedia:Requested articles/music/Operas, stage musicals and classical compositions.

Given everything else in the To-do list refers to compositions, I was wondering if the bot could be changed to include requested articles on classical compositions as well.

Thanks.

Centy 01:40, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Sure - can do!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:25, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

You need to update your barnstars on your user page and your barnstar page. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 23:23, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi - Bumfagging Hill...that was practically my first edit ever! I assure you, it's for real: see Topozone. I have no idea what the etymology is, but there's also a "Bumfagon Brook" in the town of Loudon. --Ken Gallager 19:53, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

That totally makes me laugh :) Thanks - just wanted to be sure! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:08, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the help so far. The following categories were never run:

• Category:Governors of Illinois
• Category:Lieutenant Governors of Illinois
• Category:Illinois Attorneys General
• Category:Secretaries of State of Illinois
• Category:Comptrollers of Illinois
• Category:State Treasurers of Illinois
• Category:Illinois Supreme Court justices
• Category:United States Senators from Illinois

I am including them in the list of categories. I don't know if you want to do a separate run first. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 23:35, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Are you sure you want to tag Category:Illinois Supreme Court justices and Category:United States Senators from Illinois? It seems that some or all of these categories aren't specifically related to Chicago... If so, I'll be able to run them through on Tuesday night. I still need to tweak some code to run with your project (auto-tagging isn't something that's coded in yet). I hope to get that done in the next day or two. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 02:15, 21 May 2007 (UTC)

These people all have or have had extremely high level influence over Chicago political, and legal affairs. Basically, this set of categories includes all statewide officials (their are 6 offices at the state level and 2 senators, plus it includes State of Illinois Supreme Court Justices. I think any city that accounts for at least 20 or 25% of its states voting population should include such categories. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 17:46, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Sounds good. I've set up the bot to run them tonight. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:26, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Your bot made an error while editing Talk:Sonneries de la Rose+Croix, and mistakenly created Talk:Roldán Berengué, arqts. when trying to edit Talk:Roldán+Berengué, arqts.. I assume this was caused by the + in the article titles, as HagermanBot also has been making similar errors. If you're able to, you might want to try and fix the error in your code. Otherwise, try to keep an eye on it when it tries to make edits to such articles :) --- RockMFR 08:03, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Hmph. I had a similar problem with the "&" character - I can apply the same fix for this. Thanks for bringing it to my attention!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:42, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

		The Classical Music Barnstar
		Awarded to SatyrTN and SatyrBot for tagging nearly 2000 classical music related articles with the WikiProject Classical music project banner. Award also in recognition of the maintaining of the WikiProject's To-Do List. Thank you for all your help!
		Awarded by Centy at 13:21, 22 May 2007 (UTC)	Unique ID #0001

Thanks for all your help! I'm going to recommend your bot to WikiProject Opera who may need a similar job done soon. Keep up the good work. Centy 13:21, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Awesome - thanks!! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:42, 22 May 2007 (UTC)

Could you do a demo run of your bot for Wikipedia:WikiProject Paranormal so that we can see the output. We'd be especially interested if you could expand your bot to show use which pages with our banner are tagged with Afd or Prod. We've had a number of older members leave and so their pages are no longer being watched by anybody so we can't see if they have been tagged.

perfectblue 18:16, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

I've set the bot to run tonight on your project. It's going to create two lists - a long list of all articles needing cleanup, wikification, sources, whatever - see Wikipedia:WikiProject Classical music/To-do list for an example. It also creates a short list, which is a random subset of the long list suitable for including in a "To-Do" template. See Wikipedia:WikiProject Classical music/Small to-do list for an example. Pages that may be up for deletion will show up on both. Let me know if that fits your needs. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:30, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Why did you remove him from the list? He has a videography with half a dozen films.  uriel8  (talk) 18:53, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

• Per the discussion page, only people with articles can be listed on that page. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:24, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Falwell played a major role in the the development of LGBT history in the US (at least). Isn't there an appropriate tag for that in the LGBT timeline? Benjiboi 02:07, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

While he was a misogynistic twit (IMHO), I had two reasons for removing the cat. One I stated in the edit summary - the man himself isn't LGBT history. Secondly, LGBT wasn't his only (or even his main) focus. He got some sound-bites from some of the stupid things he said, but he got those for stupid things he said about abortion, stem-cell research, heck even things about the president. So while I agree he deserves mention - in articles like Timeline of LGBT history or Homophobia or Religious intolerance - I don't think the article on the man should be in the cat. Any more than Hitler is in the cat.

All that being said, if you still disagree, bring it up at WT:LGBT - I'd love to hear what others think. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 02:13, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

I have just been comparing the article on Philip Johnson with that on Francis Johnson (architect). The article on Phillip categorises him as LGBT without a source in the article (as far as I can see). Does an article need a section on a persons private life to back up their sexual status? (serious question) Francis Johnson's partner is mentioned in the monograph refered to. Johnson's sexuality is also mentioned (in a surprisingly homophobic way) by Jonathan Glancey in an article for the Guardian in (I think) 2001 which was on line - but I have had trouble finding it in their archives recently. AFCR 09:20, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Update- I have found the Guardian article [1] and relevant quote:

"This son of an east-coast corn merchant was a tweedy-looking fogey: gay, C of E, a lifelong Tory, and little travelled."

I don't know how that would work into the wiki article though! AFCR 11:31, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, AFCR! Thanks for the questions!

I don't know either of these articles or their subjects very well, and since they have the same last name, I might get confused - bear with me if I seem stupid :)

In general, WP:LGBT holds to a pretty high standard with regard to categorizing/labeling someone. We're pretty strict about needing good references. And yes, sometimes it's hard to work a sentence and ref into the text of an article :)

PJ's article does a masterful job of working in that he was survived by his partner - I applaud that. But it's not cited, which bugs me.

FJ's article is a little sparser, so adding in his sexuality might not be too much of a problem - the "Education and early career" section, for instance, could be retitled "Personal life" and expanded a bit to include some personal information, including his sexuality. The ref, however, troubles me a little bit. While The Guardian is a pretty reliable source, the offhand way his sexuality is mentioned makes me want a second source.

Those are my thoughts. If I can help with anything, let me know - I'll be glad to help out as best I can! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:49, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

I will have to get hold of the Francis Johnson monograph and cite it as a source - I know the information is in there some where! AFCR 15:00, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Don't call it an unreliable source when you know nothing about it. It is as reliable as USAToday and just as boring. NIghtjar 12:27, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

I don't find USAToday to be RS either :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:37, 25 May 2007 (UTC)

Why does SatyrBot says every article on Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project has 4 projects when some have more than 4? Just now for example I found Talk:Coleman Hawkins with 5 projects. 15:03, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

It's only counting project banners that have had the "nested" coding added. So since you added the code to {{Jazz-music-project}} after the bot had run, it didn't recognize the banner. Thanks for your work on the cleanup, BTW! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:17, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

So, wait, there are absolutely no articles with more than 4 nest-enabled banners? o.O

I've also replaced some GA/PR with {{ArticleHistory}}, but ArticleHistory is much harder to do properly, with having to find dates of peer review and Good Article Nomination and whatnot. But when done, in conjunction with this, makes for tidier talk pages. Shinhan 18:09, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Much tidier, IMHO. ArticleHistory is a pain. Theoretically, GimmeBot (I think that's who it was) was going to handle it automatically, but I haven't seen any activity there.

That's correct, by the way - there are no articles that have more than 4 nest-enabled banners that haven't already been nested. Of course, the situation changes slightly every time a new banner gets the nesting code. That's why the bot runs the check every week. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 19:13, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey there... SatyrBot emptied Category:Oratorios by George Frideric Handel by removing the tag from all the articles yesterday. I'm not sure why it did this; edits say "per request of WP:CM", but as a "maintainer" of sorts for these articles I'm not sure why this was done? Looking at the talk pages, I don't see where the request came from and this doesn't make sense for me. Maybe there's something I don't know about? Can you shed some light on this? Sorry for the confusion and thanks for your help! Fred 05:19, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Fred! On the bot's current project page, up at the top, is the note I was working from. CenturionZ went through WP:CM's categories and divided them into sections - those that the bot was to tag and those the bot was to ignore. The third section is the two categories that were to be emptied.

If that's incorrect, I've kept a log of the articles, so I don't mind "undoing" what was done. But would you check with Centurion and/or WP:CM to see what the reasoning was? Hope I didn't mess up! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:16, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Sorry, this is all my fault. I drew up the list with some categories that seemed redundant. One was Category:BMV catalogue which had all its articles duplicated in Category: Compositions by Bach and the other was Category: Handel Oratorios. When it was brilliantly cleaned up, I forgot to remove it from the clean up list. Hopefully this isn't too hard a job to revert. Sorry again! Centy 21:45, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Shouldn't be any trouble. Just to make sure I understand, add both categories back to the articles they were removed from? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:23, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

No need to do anything, we've already done taken care of everything. :-) Centy 19:32, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

This is absolutely what we need. Is there any way that we can transclude this onto our project page?

perfectblue 15:14, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

Even better - tell me where you want to put it and I'll have the bot write it directly there instead of to the sub-page. By the way - how often do you want it run? Every week? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:18, 26 May 2007 (UTC)

I'll have to get some form of consensus over this with the project, but personally I'd like roughly what you have already written just below the to do list on our project front page. AS for run time,would every 48 hours be too often?

perfectblue 10:14, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

What I've done for WP:LGBT is to create two pages in project space where the bot puts its run. Then we have Wikipedia talk:WikiProject LGBT studies/to do which transcludes the short list. You could do something similar on the front page - instead of the "New / Improve" section, just transclude the new "short list".

48 hours should be fine. I'll set the bot to run it - just let me know where you decide to put the page. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:23, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

silly question, but how do I transclude? Is it just putting those brackets in? I had a look at the short version and you appear to have left one LGBT field in. I will have a fiddle with the code and see what seems right. - perfectblue 14:09, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Yep - that's all you do. In this case, if you want to transclude the short list into another page, simply put in {{User_talk:SatyrBot/Paranormal}} - or whatever page it is in your project space.

I'm not sure how that LGBT page came up on your deletion page - I think I had two versions of the bot running at the same time. I'm going to see if it does it again tonight. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:54, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

See reply. Simply south 17:28, 27 May 2007 (UTC)

Please try to be sure that the code you suggest under editprotected's is correct. Your most recent editprotected request had an errant line break that caused an error. Cheers. --MZMcBride 04:07, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

That'll teach me. I normally copy the code directly, but having to scroll right to see it all was annoying, so I added the line breaks - sorry about that!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:09, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

It seems WP:CM just can't leave you alone! Anyway, I've realised that one important category totally got left off the list of categories needing our banner and that Category:Classical composition stubs which is kind of an important category of all our stubby articles. If you could just run your bot and put {{Template:Classical}} in all articles in this category which do not yet have the banner, that would be great!

Cheers, and thanks for all you help. Centy 10:46, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Done! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:19, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

I've responded on my talk page. adamrice 15:56, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey, I see you've been removing LGBT categories on redirects. I have done this myself because I always thought redirects shouldn't have categories, until I recently read Wikipedia:Redirect#Categories for redirect pages. It does allow for categories if they are not creating redundant listings. As a matter of fact, this has been specifically accommodated by having redirects appear italicized in the target categories. It seems to me that it is important to have Ronald Kray listed in an LGBT category, but his main article is a combined one with his twin, who is not gay (so categorizing that article and thus both brothers as LGBT would be incorrect). As a matter of fact, this exact article is what got me to research this in the first place. This also applies to the Dynasty supporting characters Ted Dinard, Luke Fuller and Bart Fallmont, who are all part of one "minor characters" article (and don't require their own articles) but I feel should be listed under Category:Fictional gay men. What do you think? TAnthony 15:23, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Personally, I don't like cats on redirect pages. If the subject doesn't warrant an article all by themselves, then why should they be in a cat? For instance, if Ronald doesn't have his own page, then why do we want him in the "Bisexual people" category? The article on the twins could go in "LGBT history" or something like that, though.

And the same with the Dynasty characters - if they don't warrant their own page, why do we want them in the cats?

Part of my dislike of cats on redirects is strictly from an order-vs-chaos thing. Redirects aren't pages - they simply point to pages. Categorizing them gives them some sort of fuzzy standing as "almost-page", which just seems wrong. Silly of me, but you asked :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:41, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

I see your point, and it's certainly not worth arguing about! But I think these articles are consolidated to be more efficient — separating the Kray twins would create two very similar articles and the Dynasty guys would be stubs — and you're omitting them from an applicable category on a technicality. Of course, I use categories to find articles, and for me personally it would be helpful to have these items there; I know some people have different ideas about what a category should be used for. Redirects are often for alternate/duplicate names/terms (like J.Lo redirecting to Jennifer Lopez), but that is not really the case here. And I know at least one user objects to the Kray twins article being classified as LGBT in its entirety because that's what got me into this, LOL. In any case, I'm not going to press the issue, but I'm wondering if you see the exception; I think these particular items are notable enough to be categorized LGBT. I don't necessarily agree that to be considered LGBT, and article/reference has to be a certain size or someone/something has to be a certain amount gay. TAnthony 19:03, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

My main issue isn't a technicality - it's notability. If the Dallas characters aren't notable enough to have an article, why have them in the cat?

The Kray twins are a different matter - Ron isn't notable by himself. And if the other editor disagrees with the LGBT banner (or cat), he hasn't seen the movie - talk about homoeroticism! I think that article (not the redirect) could legitimately be put in an LGBT cat - and have our banner. Maybe we should get a third opinion? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 19:07, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Don't make me split out the Dynasty guys into their own articles just to thwart you! LOL, I'm cool with keeping them as is. And the Kray editor was fine with the combined article being tagged with the Project banner (and it is currently), he just didn't like them both in the category. So, I will let it go and all is well. Boy, you're tough. ;) TAnthony 19:13, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Conviction :) I spend a lot of time (too much) on the cats and banners, so I feel strongly about them :) But seriously, shouldn't the Krays be in an LGBT cat? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 19:17, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Probably, but only one was gay. But hey, do it if you wish and make your argument later if you have to. ;) TAnthony 02:02, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi there-- as we have seen with Charles Nelson Reilly and others, the infobox template as it stands is both heterosexist and US-centric. People who wish to diminish the value and legitimacy of LGBT relationships, or promote a DOMA-type definition of "marriage" in general because of a personal belief POV, will make the argument we saw on the Reilly talk page. The issue is not just that article, but the template itself.

As the least contentious option, I would propose a second line be added to the template right under "spouse =" that says something general enough to cover all serious committed relationships. Reilly and Hughes were together for 27 years. Some heterosexual couples are together for long periods without marrying. Perhaps "companion =" or "life partner =" or "partner ="? I'd prefer something like that over a more sexualized term like "lover =" or something less serious like "boyfriend =" etc. Perhaps once we think on this a bit, we can raise the issue on the template talk page after reaching consensus among the LGBT editorial project team? In a perfect world, any committed relationship would be given at least the same recognition as, say, Britney Spears' 55-hour marriage to Jason Allen Alexander. Jokestress 23:09, 31 May 2007 (UTC)

Hey genius, can you be of help here? Thanks in advance. TAnthony 06:01, 1 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I found another batch that probably should get LGBT tags:

• Execution of Justice - play about the Dan White trial (he killed Harvey Milk)
• Carol Leigh - bi and sex-worker activist
• Trauma Flintstone - queer performer
• Sandy "Mama" Reinhardt - kink community leader

Is she lesbian or bisexual?

• Donna Sachet - gay drag artist
• Susan Leal‎ - out lesbian politician

It's not mentioned in the article at all?

Thank you! Benjiboi 09:15, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

also

• Vogue‎ (dance) - from the gay ballroom scene Benjiboi 11:37, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey Satyr, I just joined Wikiproject Alabama. With agreement from some of the existing members, I'm asking if you'd use SatyrBot to tag articles in Category:Alabama and its subcategories with {{WikiProject Alabama |class= }}? Is this feasible?  :) Aleta 18:09, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, can you add this as a starter page or ? in the LGBT project? It was a significant show and possibly more important it was a visionary projectto get queers into new media and Lavender Lounge continues now as a website still chronicling (mostly adult gay porn but other cultural events). Article certainly needs help but for now just tagging is a good start. 04:58, 2 June 2007 Benjiboi

Hi SatyrTN,

Here's what I read in the Frankfurter Allgemeine Zeitung article about Inge Meysel.

She said in 1992 to Deutsche Presse-Agentur "I was bisexual, I the mother of the nation... I have learned to know bodily love through a woman at 17. But that was the only time."

She said in 2001 to the magazine Bunte "Who ever is not bisexual is missing the best of course."

This article from 2000 [2] reports on an interview and the headline is 'Inge Meysel: bisexual and happy'. It claims that Meysel had her first and last sex with a woman.

A Yahoo search in German [3] produces many results. Gilliam 21:58, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks mucho! So what do you think? Bisexual? One experience? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:19, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for looking at this article. Could you consider tagging for LGBT? The director is openly bi and a whore! Also it's for all sex-workers which includes LGBT folks. Benjiboi 13:24, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm not so sure that fits into the scope... If the director gets a page, I'll happily tag hers, but since it's not specifically LGB or T, I don't feel comfortable including it. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:22, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

It's been tagged for the sexuality project which is probably a better match. Benjiboi 23:25, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, the thing is, having two different pages on the same topic tends to confuse people. It generally helps having one centralized discussion rather than two (with, inevitably, people having to repeat themselves, or people unaware of the other one). Another detail is that it's tricky to see the difference between the two pages.

I would suggest either of the following: first, note that you can edit proposals. Indeed, the whole point of a proposal is that people can edit it to add other ideas and/or remove not-so-good ideas, because this improves the proposal. If someone objects to that, discuss it on the talk page. Or second, you could add a section on the talk page like "I like this proposal but would want this changed", or "I don't like this proposal but it would be better if..." or something like that. If there is no substantial objection to your idea, add it to the main page.

HTH! >Radiant< 15:37, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

• I fail to see why you can't simply overwrite the original too-bureaucratic version with the new discussed-and-improved version? >Radiant< 15:44, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

I cannot come up with anything at the moment. In all likelihood he was a bisexual with a penchant for youths, but none of the main sources I just checked has anything on him. I will have access to more materials later in the summer. Haiduc 04:46, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

See "Subtopic categorization" over at Wikipedia:Categorizing redirects.

All of the characters on the show have redirects pointing to the main page. For example, Alan Shepard (Halfway Home) has a "Fictional arsonists" category, Sebastian "C-Bass" Yates has a "Fictional hackers" category, ect. --DrBat 22:45, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

According to policy, "In some cases, however, adding categories to a redirect page allows legitimate alternative titles or names to be found in category lists."

Not adding categories to redirects applies to stuff like adding Category:Domesticated animals to Cats, when Cat already has said category. --DrBat 21:10, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

You'll notice that "policy" is still in the proposed stage and under current discussion. In fact there's been talk on that page about this specific subject. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:22, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Could we just wait to see what happens with the discussion before doing anything? --DrBat 21:44, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

I'm leaving Eulogio alone :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:57, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

We are getting ready to roll. I assume we will need two banner templates, one simple for the Opera Project (Template:WikiProject Opera) and another new one for stub class which I propose to call Template:Operastubclass. Is that OK? -- Kleinzach 09:47, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Kleinzach. Why would you want a separate one for stub articles? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:17, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter! Issue VII - June 1, 2007 Monthly Challenge: June Stub Review! Take a moment and sift through the roughly 3,600 Stub-class LGBT articles. Are they still stubs? If not, make an assessment change. Even better, do you see anything you can add/edit to increase the rating? Let's see if the project can lower the number of stubs down below 3,000! Project News WP:LGBT Exceeds 200 Members!! Two editors have been selected by project members as co-coordinators. Their duties are still a bit unclear, but having a few more janitors around the project will help keep us running smoothly. Please feel free to message Fireplace or SatyrTN if you have any project questions or concerns. Member News 20 new contributors joined the project in the last month (bringing total membership to 201): Illyria05, Brideshead, smartman89, Queerudite, JackFritscher, SeventhHaido, Evolauxia, Bandou, ChrisTW, NickGorton (back from break), Lynnllynn, KaiLeo, Meojive, Whstchy, Ceramykgoddess, Ljpmn79, snoopy753, Aralvarez, Enzedbrit, and Meininger. Please make them feel welcome  ! To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, just ask Dev920. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, do let her know.

Delivered on 16:00, 6 June 2007 (UTC). SatyrBot 16:35, 6 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for contributing to Wikipedia, SatyrTN! However, your edit here was reverted by an automated bot that attempts to remove spam from Wikipedia. If you were trying to insert a good link, please accept my creator's apologies, but note that the link you added, matching rule \bfreewebs\.com\/.+, is on my list of links to remove and probably shouldn't be included in Wikipedia. Please read Wikipedia's external links guidelines for more information, and consult my list of frequently-reverted sites. For more information about me, see my FAQ page. Thanks! Shadowbot 05:46, 7 June 2007 (UTC)

I did not do so, I will do it right now. Thanks for letting me know. Snoopy753 13:34, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

i just added the references from the biography i'm reading. If there is anything I might of left out, let me know. Thanks! Thismightbezach 17:30, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

It's been fixed on those two articles. It certainly was wrong before! Best regards, -- Ssilvers 15:45, 9 June 2007 (UTC)

I noted that you have added a tag to this page... I've been searching for any interviews with Roger Williams and haven't been able to find any. I don;t know where this leaves his entry, since his life as a gay man is reflected in most of his past work, but I just can't seem to find any published interviews with this rather shy man which would confirm this for you. You can take it from me, though, that there is no breach of any Wikipolicy and no libel. You could always ask the man himself, if you want! - Stevecov 21:15, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

I edited the first part of the article, regarding the lack of notability. I also removed the prod because of the recent edit. If it still does not meet the standards of notability, please let me know and I will try to fix it. Thanks!Keithbrooks 03:02, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

I re-edited the article which now has, "Since releasing his debut album, Garneau has toured in major cities, including New York , Chicago and San Fransisco" in the introduction. I believe this is congruent with the notability guidelines now. If not, please let me know. Thanks! -Keithbrooks 03:34, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

I redid the article again, removing the references that were links to blogs and Chris Garneau's Myspace page; I added references from "verifiable" sources, for both the content of the article and the major cities (in the introduction). If it is still not up to standard, please let me know. This is the first major article I have ever written and I am always looking to improve. Thank you for all your help! -Keithbrooks 04:28, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for fixing that article---it looks so much better!! You are truly a lifesaver! :) Keithbrooks 06:10, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Whoops. I went back to my wikipedian source, and found out that it was vandalism. I am removing my comment! Politics rule 16:35, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi Satyr, WikiProject Alabama now has a list of categories for tagging articles with the project banner: Wikipedia:WikiProject Alabama/Categories. Does this look like a usable list for you? Aleta 03:54, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Aleta! Wonderful! The alphabetizing is overkill for the bot, but probably better for humans ;)

There are couple questionable categories as far as the bot goes. Remember the bot tags everything in the category, so I try to keep out any that aren't at least 80% accurate. The ones I'd like you to take a look at to see if they fall into that range are:

1. The "alumni" cats - Category:Alabama A&M University alumni, Category:Auburn University alumni, Category:Spring Hill College alumni, Category:Troy University alumni, Category:Tuskegee University alumni, Category:University of Alabama alumni, Category:University of Alabama at Birmingham alumni
2. Similarly, the "college people" cats: Category:Birmingham-Southern College people, Category:Miles College people, Category:Samford University people, Category:University of Alabama in Huntsville people, Category:University of Alabama people, Category:University of North Alabama people
3. Category:Raycom Media
4. Category:Tennessee River
5. Category:Tennessee Valley Authority

Otherwise it looks great!

I'm in the middle of WP:Opera tagging at the moment, which will take a couple more days. I should be able to start on Sunday or Monday. I'd like to go with ~50 categories a night, so that means yours will take about a week to finish up.

Let me know if all this works for you! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:45, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Will you be running

• Category:DePaul University alumni
• Category:School of the Art Institute of Chicago alumni
• Category:Northwestern University alumni
• Category:Second City alumni
• Category:Community areas of Chicago
• Category:Historic Districts in Chicago
• Category:Houses in Chicago
• Category:Theatres in Chicago
• Category:Hotels in Chicago
• Category:Tourism in Chicago
• Category:Outdoor sculptures in Chicago TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 18:07, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Will do! Are all your categories on that one page - so the bot can look there for where to run the weekly update? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:03, 17 May 2007 (UTC)

Yes, but the page still has all the railroad categories, which I have yet to finish sorting out. Recall all Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Categories. Maybe using Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Categories/Tagged might be better. You could modify it as needed. Also, the run above could also include the statewide officeholders listed at Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Categories as well. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 16:33, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

I guess I get confused easily... How about this - would you create Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Bot Category List and populate it with the categories you want the bot to run through weekly? That way you have control over how the bot works with your project :) I'll get the programming to work on that page once a week.

As a side note, if for some reason there's an article that belongs in one of the Chicago categories, but doesn't get a banner, you can add {{bots|deny=SatyrBot}} to the talk page and the bot will ignore it.

Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:43, 18 May 2007 (UTC)

Do I need to make batches or can the bot handle all the categories at once for this task? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 04:19, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

Since it will only be reviewing, it should be able to handle it all at once. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:25, 20 May 2007 (UTC)

What is the progress of the regular checkup bot? — Preceding unsigned comment added by TonyTheTiger (talk • contribs) 15:44, 28 May 2007 14:40, 2 June 2007 (UTC)

I had set up the separate Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Bot Category List that you mentioned above so that you would not have to worry about the Railroad categories until I can fully examine the entire hierarchy of subcategories. However, one problem is that as new subcategories arise they will not be included. Your {{bots | deny=SatyrBot}} command might be helpful in this end if it were possible to set SatyrBot to run on subcats except for those with this command and their subcats. Then we could just set SatyrBot to run on Category:Chicago, Illinois, Category:Cook County, Illinois and a few other cats. In either case, I could go back to setting up SatyrBot to run from Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Categories instead of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Chicago/Bot Category List.

Doh! I forgot about the bot list :)

Yes, though, you're right - as new subcategories are created, they'll have to be added to the bot list. That's one of those manual tasks that has to be checked every once in a while to keep the bot running smoothly.

Kewl - I'll set the bot to run tonight and will check on things tomorrow to see how it did. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:56, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

I mis-spoke. The bot isn't scheduled to run until Thursday night - should I run it tonight as a special run or wait until then? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:39, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

From my perspective the sooner and more often the better so tonight and Thursday is good. TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 16:13, 4 June 2007 (UTC)

(unindent) Has the bot rechecked all the cats yet? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 19:30, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the update. Keep me informed. When you get everything fixed, will I still be able to look here for a summary? TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 23:00, 11 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't think the full run completed because it cut off at J in the alphabet.--TonyTheTiger (talk/cont/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 04:46, 12 June 2007 (UTC)

I don't know why it kept quitting, but I sat here to watch it finish [4]. Hopefully Thursday's run won't cause any problems, but I'll watch for it. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:10, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

Were we suppose to be the current project this morning? It seemed to work on another project. TonyTheTiger 11:51, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

[5] and at 7:47, 7:52, and 7:53.

But that's a very good point. It's too easy to lose the ongoing maintenance logs if there's a current project going. I'm moving the maintenance logs over to User:SatyrBot/Maintenance logs. I'm also changing the schedule so it runs on Mondays and Thursdays. And finally, I'm in the process of trying out some new code that will automatically add the banner into {{WikiProjectBannerShell}} and/or {{WikiProjectBanners}} when it finds them. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:40, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

The template insertion will be a great feature. I will be watching [User:SatyrBot/Project_list#WikiProject_Chicago here]. I am not sure what you are saying is lost. Thanks for the hard work. --TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 22:17, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

That log page is for "projects". For ongoing maintenance, you'll want to watch User:SatyrBot/Maintenance logs. By lost I meant that having "projects" and "maintenance" logs on the same page, it was hard to find one versus the other :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 23:00, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, all ready. -- Kleinzach 23:44, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I note that you have been working with Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera, seemingly on some sort of assessments. I inquired on the talk page of the project if there were any link that they would want included in the Project Directory, and all that has happened is that Kleinzach altered the headline of the comment, without any sort of response. As you seem to be the one doing the work, whatever it is, I was wondering if you might be able to give me some idea what if anything to put in the directory regarding this matter. Thank you. John Carter 01:21, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Give me a chance! I need to read each of your messages about 5 times to try to work out what they mean - especially as you never use paragraphs! I added the headline to attract attention to it. Headings starting "Sorry for butting in again" are not the most descriptive of the contents. (Apologies to SatyrTN for using your space). -- Kleinzach 01:42, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, John! My bot is adding their banner to articles within their scope. I'll nudge the project, but don't really have any clout :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:27, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply. No need to try to nudge them, I was just wondering how to handle the Directory. John Carter 01:29, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

No problem - as a (semi-) active member of WikiProject Council and someone that deals with a lot of projects, I feel the need to nudge! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:31, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

I dont like to see the cleanup page empty so often. Would it be possible to make the bot run daily? Shinhan 12:26, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

Not particularly... the bot works really hard when it's working on that list. I might run it twice a week, though I suspect we're getting towards the end of the usefulness of a bot-generated list. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:29, 10 June 2007 (UTC)

How long does it take to work on it? I whipped together a quick prototype and tested it, and it evaluated 10000 talk pages in 110 seconds. I have no idea how long it'd take for an entire run, seeing as I have no idea how many Talk pages there are (the magic word is disabled, as any query of that type would be slow.) If you benchmark yours and yours is faster than mine, we must trade secrets.  ;) If not, I'll give it to you or host it on the Toolserver. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 03:27, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

LOL. I just changed api.php's output format from XML to PHP, since the XML processing was resource-intensive, and the benchmark is now 10000 talk pages in 27 seconds. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 03:56, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

How in the world would you do that? Go through every talk page and "process" it to see how many talk pages there were? Ouch! You do realize that's ... 1,833,633 pages to go through? The way I've done it (which may not be the best way) is to get the templates that have nested coding, go through them and pull a list of pages that have them embedded. I save those lists to a database, then pull select the articles that have more than 3 banners. But do let me know how you're doing it - I'm always game for trading ideas!

BTW, did you get my question about the regexp? I'm only a novice-to-intermediate regexper, so I get stumped by the nested brackets. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:16, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes, I did, and I answered on my talk page.  :)

Keep in mind that not all articles have Talk pages; indeed, many don't. My prototype:

1. Requests a list of all templates in Category:WikiProject banners (or uses a cached copy if it has one).
2. Requests a list of all talk pages and the templates they transclude (I can give you the api.php query string; it's actually a reasonably fast query. Bots can request 5000 pages at a time.)
3. It then checks those transcluded templates against WikiProject banners and determines the number of banners on each page. If the number of banners is four or more, and the talk page does not transclude {{WikiProjectBanners}} or {{WikiProjectBannerShell}}, it flags the page.

I like the simple solutions. They work for me.  :) — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 05:18, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I haven't switched over to api.php yet - I'm still working with query.php. 5000!!!! I'm going to have to do that!

Do you end up requesting the same information several times? I mean, take talk:sample page as an example. If it has three banners, are you requesting a banner transclusion list for that page three times?

I'd love to see that api query - I bet I can speed my system up quite a bit by switching to api.php and cleaning up my code some. It's so nice to chat code :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:44, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I'll post the code itself at some point -- I'm still working on its framework. It works; now I want to make it bulletproof, versatile, and pretty. Anyhow, the API query is:

$client->get('http://en.wikipedia.org/w/api.php?format=php&action=query&generator=allpages&gapnamespace=1&gaplimit=5000&prop=templates&gapfrom=' . rawurlencode($gapfrom));

Explanation: allpages is used as a generator, with the namespace for the pages returned being limited to 2 (Talk:) and the number of pages returned being limited to 5000 (the maximum). Any and all template transclusions for those generated pages are then retrieved and returned.

Pages are requested only once, 5000 at a time. If one page were queried, it'd look like this (irrelevant attributes removed):

Array
(
    [query] => Array
        (
            [pages] => Array
                (
                    [6754699] => Array
                        (
                            [title] => Talk:!
                            [templates] => Array
                                (
                                    [0] => Array
                                        (
                                            [title] => Template:Welcometotalk
                                        )
                                )
                        )
                )
        )
)

That templates array contains all template transclusions. No need to ever query more than once.

Want me to run the bot, see how long it takes, then put its report in Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project so we can look for any logic errors? It's within my scope and does no editing, so I wouldn't file another BRFA (look what's happening to my existing one.) — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 16:25, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Why don't you run it and put it at Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project_MBAA (along with a mktime() determination on how long it takes). I'll run mine and put it at Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project_SB with the time as well - we can compare outputs and times and see how it looks. If I get around to it - which I probably won't until next week - I'll make the switch to api.php. Doesn't look like the results come back much different than query.php did.

Once I've made the switch, we can swap code - I need to pretty mine up just a tad, but I'm reasonably happy with the functionality it's got. There's probably some security issues I need to examine, but I'm not always good at spotting those.

-- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:45, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

BTW, is it possible to do something like:

query.php?what=backlinks&titles=Template:WPBiography|Template:LGBTProject&bllimit=10&blnamespace=1

Except listing all the nested templates and with the expanded bllimit? The result would be all pages that have at least one nested template. I'm not sure if you'd save time, but then you wouldn't have to go through all talk pages. Just a quick thought. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:52, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

It's possible, but I'd like to check for all WikiProject banners, not just those that support nesting, because those that don't and that reside with three or more other banners should still be nested, either via a change in code or via {{BannerShell}}. And I don't want to pipe together the titles of every WikiProject banner. I'll think about it, though, after this bot run. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 17:01, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

(outdent) Haha. My bot got to the Ns, then hit my memory limit. I'll have to review the code; I can't think of any reason why that would occur. The first report will be somewhat delayed, though. :P — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 23:38, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Haha. Here's a hint. If you use HTTP_Client, which I recommend, do disable the history. I don't recommend storing every response from the server. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 23:47, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

Is that a CURL thing? Or an alternative to CURL? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 00:58, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

It's an alternative; I use it because it has a cookie manager and it's easy to work with. You may like it. HTTP_Client — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 01:14, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

 Done – Bot run completed. You can view the report at Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project MBAA as you suggested. It seems this method catches more than yours does, though I'm not sure why that should be. The runtime isn't too bad, considering 42% of it is spent throttling and 42% is spent receiving data. Tell me what you think. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 05:04, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Any chance of sorting by number of banners? Now to see stats for SatyrTN's bot... Shinhan 06:44, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

I could do that; it'd just require running another routine after the bot run has completed. It goes through Talk pages alphabetically. You'll find, however, that there are few 5s or 6s. I think there's one 7. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 06:47, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

 Done &ndash - see it at Template:WikiProjectBannerShell/Cleanup project SB. 3 hours, 11 minutes. I thought for sure yours would be quicker. Mine found 254 fewer than yours, probably because mine restricts itself to nested banners.

When I have some time (next week?) I'll see about converting to api.php - maybe that will bring the time down. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:23, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Eh. So it's a tradeoff between speed and thoroughness, as most bot runs are. Mine isn't very processor-intensive; I should see about getting another account on the Toolserver. Then I could use cron to run it and not have to worry about it. The greater accessibility to the Wikimedia cluster might also mean less request time (thus, less throttle time). I should also try running it during off-peak hours (I haven't checked them yet) and see if that improves speed. A good exercise!  :) — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 14:48, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

How does one get an account on the toolserver? Is MySQL available? That's where my bot runs some processes - the DB work. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:58, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

m:Toolserver/New accounts. MySQL is available. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 15:00, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Hey there, I'm wondering why LGBT literature isn't coming up in the to do list as being in need of expansion; it is tagged, but perhaps the bot is missing the categories? TAnthony 16:15, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

It's there under Wikipedia talk:WikiProject LGBT studies/to do full list#Articles to Clean Up. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:42, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

We are conducting research into the role of social norms in online communication. This research is funded by the European Union and is being undertaken by a coalition of European Universities (see http://emil.istc.cnr.it/?q=node/8). The research is designed to help us understand how social norms interact with the technology that supports online collaboration. We have selected 35 Wikipedia articles flagged as controversial for study. We are analysing the interactions on the discussion pages and are also seeking additional input from contributors to those discussions.

As a participant in the recent discussion about a controversial topic - Christina Aguilera, I would be very grateful if you could follow the link to a simple questionnaire. This should take only 2 minutes to complete.

http://survey.soc.surrey.ac.uk//public/survey.php?name=wiki_norms

Bugs-Bunny Bunny 21:42, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

Re Project Paranormal, please go ahead and put it in place however you feel is most appropriate. - perfectblue 10:19, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I've been asked to sort out a list of categories for feeding to Satyrbot so that it will tag all of the Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera pages. What complicates things is that a sub-project Wikipedia:WikiProject Gilbert and Sullivan exists and I've been asked to exclude their stuff. Some categories, such as Category:English-language operas contains both G&S stuff and opera stuff. Is there a way to instruct Satyrbot not to tag things already tagged by the G&S project or to ignore members of Category:Comic Operas or something? Thanks in advance. --Peter cohen 17:38, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

That's quite possible. In fact, WP:CM asked me not to tag articles that had your tag already, so I programmed that function in to the bot :)

Will y'all want "quality" ratings on the tags? SatyrBot can automatically tag articles with "Stub" if the article has a stub tag on it.

Let me know if you have any other questions - I'm glad to help! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:43, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the prompt reply. It was our becoming aware of your work with WP:CM that raised our interest in using the bot too. A debate has now started on whether bot-tagging is a good idea or not, so I'll be back to you when it's resolved. --Peter cohen 22:07, 23 May 2007 (UTC)

NP - let me know either way :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 00:02, 24 May 2007 (UTC)

Hello again. I am going ahead with this request. Could I check with you how to format the list of categories whose member articles should be tagged? Also could you let me know if I can give generic formats for categories? I'll want to tag everything in a category with a format Category:Operas by xxx, where xxx is a composer name, apart from the ones that are explicitly excluded because they belong to a sub-project (i.e Gilbert and Sullivan) which we can do by noticing their tags as you suggested above. I also would want to tag everything in Category: xxxx operas or Category xxxxs operas where xxxx is a year and xxxxs is a decade.

Thanks in advance for your advice --Peter cohen 10:51, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Peter!

What I recommend is starting with the <categorytree> command at a "top level" category. You do this by editing a page and putting in <categorytree>Opera</categorytree>. That will give you a list of categories that fall under the top-level one, with each of the sub categories having a [+] next to it.

The next step takes a bit of time. Go through each of the plus signs and click them, bringing up the sub-categories for that sub. And so forth, going down the tree. When you come to a cat where either all sub-cats don't need to be tagged, or where you're repeating (so there's a circular category in there), click the minus to hide it. The goal of this exercise is to come up with a list of categories where most of them will be cats you want to include. Be careful not to leave that page, since the tree will revert back to its starting point if you do.

Once your list is complete, select the text on the web page and copy/paste it into either a text document or editing a page. You can then delete any strays that don't belong and save it. I can take that list and work from it.

It's a bit of work, but the advantages are a) it's complete, and b) you have an ordered list you can work from and add to the project's work pages.

Let me know if you have any questions or if I can help with anything in the process. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:48, 29 May 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. I have now created a list at User:Peter cohen/opera categories. I've also created a discussion at the heading Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Opera#List of categories for the bot User:Peter cohen/opera categories. I think we should let this run for a week or so before you process the list. You might also care to comment on the sub-heading for singers as there is a suggestion that everyone called a soprano etc should be processed. Regards --Peter cohen 08:44, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Hi. The opera list is ready for a run as soon as User:Kleinzach gives the go ahead. There are now three sections in the list which has been split into sections. Those to be included in every run. Those not to be touched and a third section of voice categories to be run once off in the first run. I've asked Kleinzach to let you know directly when he's done the preparations on the voice categories. In the mid-term the list of categories should be moved somewhere else, presumably a sub-page of the opera projectpage. We'll let you know when this happens. Regards --Peter cohen 11:45, 3 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank very much for your help, both practical and advice etc. --Peter cohen 12:07, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

NP - glad to help! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 00:28, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

for our ratings that doesn't require me to do any work so I can suggest it here. :)

WP:BIOGRAPHY and WP:FILM both have much stricter rating systems than we do. So if you ran your bot to find articles that are tagged by both them and us, a higher rating from them should means we can promote our rating without even needing to look at it. Which would save us a lot of bother, depending on for many articles that is the situation. What do you think? DevAlt 09:47, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

I love cunning plans! Especially when it means less work! Good idea - let me see what I can whip the bot into doing... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:19, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Excellent! Btw, when I get back, I'm going to create a list of tasks I keep up with as coordinator. That way you and everyone else can pitch in at will when I'm away. Sorry for not defining the role more, it got a bit rushed toward the end... DevAlt 15:09, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

NP! We're stumbling along :) That sounds like a really good idea, though. And I saw today that someone really kewl is back! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:04, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

BTW - nice job! 53 articles, though I downgraded a couple of WPBios that were terribly wrong. So 45 upgrades :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:12, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Wonderful! Can we add that to the list of bot tasks needing redoing on a monthly basis? Also, main purpose of my message: can you cross reference the List of LGB people with list of bisexual people and list of transgender people, and then bot-update the to-find-references for list? It's been bugging me for some time that there are people on the bisexual list that we're expending effort on to write another entry for through ignorance, but I noticed a fair few in the transgendered list (Divine, for example, is on the transgendered list, with reference, but is on our needs references list) as well today. It might save us a little bit of time.

I've got six more days of exam season to go, and then I'm back! I'm going to try my damndest to polish off that list, and then prepare it for an FL nom. I reckon if we get it featured, it's then going to be fairly simple to create additional lists from it - our lists on LGBT Jews, activists, bisexual and transgendered people, and I think we ought to create lists of living LGBT people, LGBT Muslims, and LGBT Christians as well. If we simply copy the same format (after it makes FL!) and cross reference the main list with the relevant categories, fixing them all up to FL should be easy and we can have our first Featured Topic, "List of LGBT people", by the end of 2007. What do you think? :) 62.30.56.116 02:27, 17 June 2007 (UTC) (Dev920)

How come your bot classified Talk:Accept as having 4 projects when I cant find any time in the talk history when it had more than 3? Shinhan 11:24, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Good catch! Because Talk:ACCEPT also has a banner... I'm fixing the bot to be case sensitive - thanks for bringing it to my attention!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:18, 5 June 2007 (UTC)

Another two pages with same problem: Talk:Baekdu Mountain and Talk:Bambi, tagged as 4 but have only 3 projects each. Shinhan 16:55, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Hmph. I thought I'd fixed the code, but evidently I hadn't. I've made the change now. BTW, Talk:Baekdu Mountain had a {{mountain}} stuck further down the page. I've fixed that. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:59, 8 June 2007 (UTC)

Found one more: Talk:Qi and Talk:QI both have 2 banners each. Btw, there is no Qi on MBAA's cleanup list. Shinhan 06:20, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

And ANOTHER pair Talk:Saga and Talk:SaGa. Shinhan 16:59, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

It's been established that he and Luke will date in the future, which makes him either gay or bisexual.[6] I'll add a source, though.--DrBat 13:40, 17 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi SatyrTN. Really quick: Is there a standard layout template for NH articles on cities and towns? I've had a look at the project page and cannot find one. I asked someone else (see User_talk:Ken_Gallager#NH_Article_standards) and he could not find one either and directed me to you. As one of your projects is standardizing NH articles, I hope you're the correct person to ask! Many thanks, JordanSealy 16:40, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the reply! Very helpful. Getting any kind of consensus on WP is difficult, regardless of how many editors are working on a project. At some point it'll probably come up in the project discussion... The WP:CITIES template appears to be under proposal, so it may be a while yet... Thanks again, JordanSealy 17:23, 18 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi. Sorry for the late reply. The reason I included Almásy in the category is because he is also listed in the LGBT category at the Hungarian Wikipedia. An English language source about this can be found here and here. Thanks, Ronline ✉ 06:42, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

heyo! On the Hirschfeld Eddy Foundation AfD I suggested inviting German-speaking LGBT editors to look at article and/or subject's website as the Hirschfeld Eddy Foundation website[7]. Not speaking German I'm not sure what might be a way of doing that but the website does seem to have a media section which might solve the notability issue. Any ideas? Benjiboi 01:45, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I noticed on the next run, Category:People from Columbus, Georgia somehow made the cut. Seems we missed that one on the list. The bot hasn't gone through these categories, but we need to remove this one before it does. Thanks, - auburnpilot talk 04:06, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

Regarding your question on my Claremont, New Hampshire additions to the Broad St. Park content, I got them from the city website, from their Parks & Rec Summer 2007 Brochure. I was unsure if I had to cite it, since I found it on the city's main site. You can see it here: http://www.claremontnh.com/residents/departments/documents/SpringSummer2007Brochure.pdf Also, I am a Claremont native and know some more tidbits about the Claremont American Band (my dad has been the director for the last 30+ years), but I have no way to cite them, so I haven't. Maybe someday. The group has a very rich history. - User:Eevensen 09:25, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

We've been talking about your kind offer regarding 'To do' lists here. If you have a moment I wonder if you can join us? Thanks. -- Kleinzach 12:52, 19 June 2007 (UTC)

We'd like to go ahead with this if you have the time. I assume the lists would go on subpages of the project page linked to the upper part of the project page (beside the Can you help? section or whatever). One question: would the bot catch all pages with the opera banner, including new pages bannered by hand? -- Kleinzach 23:18, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

As I have yet to see the film myself, I don't what to write without copying from some other website's synopsis . But it is a gay film. [8] --Silvestris 17:13, 21 June 2007 (UTC)

I just spent some time removing non-Alabama articles from the Alabama project, but I think there are many more that were incorrectly flagged as being in Alabama. (Notably, apparently everything associated with TVA was flagged as being in Alabama.) I hope you can work out a non-tedious way of making the remaining corrections.--orlady 15:01, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Not his fault - I compiled the cat list. I've gone through the TVA cat and removed the AL tage from any pages where it didn't belong if they hadn't already had the tag removed. Mea culpa. Aleta 16:32, 23 June 2007 (UTC)

Ouch. And I think the bot just re-did them, since I hadn't had a chance to change the cat list. Double mea-culpa! I'll check on this and get to removing them. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:33, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, no! What a pain... Aleta 07:02, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Yeh - sorry about that. Luckily, the log file should make reverting those easier. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:05, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, after reviewing the logs, it looks like Aleta removed TVA from the cat list before the bot ran, so no need to panic! Thanks, Aleta :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:12, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Oh, good. I'm glad neither of us has to redo that!  :) Thanks for doing all this tagging, Satyr. Sure, we had a few glitches like these, but overall, this saves a lot of work! Aleta 07:16, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

NP - it's Gnome Week, so you lucked out :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:17, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

• Since you are pretty much the only one doing this, hope you don't mind I do the requests on your page. {{ice hockey}} needs nesting when you have a chance. Thank you!--Kranar drogin 03:16, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

Not a problem :) It's protected, so I've put in a request. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:55, 28 May 2007 (UTC)

• {{WikiProject Lithuania}} needs the code when you have the chance. Thanks again!--Kranar drogin 11:30, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

Done. :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:02, 30 May 2007 (UTC)

• Found another {{WikiProject Formula One}}, when you get a chance. Thanks!--Kranar drogin 22:34, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

 Done - along with {{WikiProject Motorsport}} and {{WikiProject Formula One}}. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:48, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

• Thanks much! Also, there seems to be a space in {{WPBiography}} as seen in Talk:Gene Cichowski. Do you know if this is something that can be fixed? I know I could put it at the bottom of the list for a quick fix, but I figure it would be better to get it in the long run.--Kranar drogin 23:01, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

 DoneIt was {{ChicagoWikiProject}}. I've fixed it. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 23:07, 13 June 2007 (UTC)

• I found another error in the projects Talk:Wild Bill Hickok. Just another space. Thanks!--Kranar drogin 22:54, 15 June 2007 (UTC)

 DoneFixed - I just moved the comments to the end, since they are almost always what's causing the space: [9]

-- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:37, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• I tried it with the problem here Talk:Moose Krause, but it didn't work for me. So, here is another with a space problem.--Kranar drogin 02:32, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

 Done by TAnthony at 02:48, 16 June 2007. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 03:13, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• Sorry I keep finding these errors, but here is a double whammy Talk:Evan Lysacek.--Kranar drogin 14:23, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

 DonePlease dont be sorry, debugging is very important! Unfortunatelly WPBiography is protected, extremely common (300k+ transclusions) and its editors are unwilling to even change colspan=2 to colspan=3. Though, I have found out that WPBiography only sometimes creates that extraneous spacing below it, and never if its last in the BannersHell.

Also, Im warning you to put |blp=yes on articles about living persons! As Template:WikiProjectBannerShell documentation states you should always put that in if the article has WPBiography template with option |living=yes. Shinhan 14:52, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• {{WikiProject Smashing Pumpkins}} needs nesting.--Kranar drogin 14:54, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

 DoneFigure Skating fixed. Problem was in the line

"<!-- ELSE: Comments do not exist --> &nbsp;}}"

there should NOT be anything between --> and }}, and especially not a non braking space. You do know about Template talk:WikiProjectBannerShell right? Also, I did the Smashing Pumpkins. Shinhan 15:18, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• Another thing with WPBiography, is that it doesn't seem to want to nest the "|needs-photo=yes" but it will for the "|needs-photo=no".--Kranar drogin 17:12, 16 June 2007 (UTC) Example: Talk:Phil Masi--Kranar drogin 18:11, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• Nesting is needed for {{WP Adventist}}, thanks again.--Kranar drogin 18:02, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

lol, Good luck on getting WPBiography folks to nest the needs-infobox. If you'r only worried about the needs-photo just remove it and put the {{reqphoto}} below the BannersHell.

 Done Adventist Shinhan 18:13, 16 June 2007 (UTC)

• Nesting is need for {{Wikiproject_Pro_Gaming}} when you get a chance.--Kranar drogin 15:15, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

 Done - thanks for finding these!! SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:28, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your welcome! I've been getting my room all tidied from its previous strewn-with-tons-of-paper-and-dirty-dishes state, and now I can get on with stuff. First I have to deal with this Austin FAR, catch up on what's happened to my watchlist, and write up my promised Coordinator checksheet, and then I'm going to tear into the LGBT lists. Would you mind awfully quickly cross referencing List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people with the bisexual and transgender lists and update the to-add list? I noticed there are duplicates and I don't want to waste any time. Btw, you've sure stuck a massive dent in that list! Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:57, 22 June 2007 (UTC) (God, I love being able to sign my own name again...)

ROTFL!

I'll run the bot check later today. I've only gotten through half the "W"s, but I also add people that come up on WP:LGBT/NP, so I've been adding quite a few. I'll be glad to see you working on it, too :)

BTW, the project seems to have slowed down as far as the talk page goes. But we keep getting new people, so I'm not worried if we plateau for a bit. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:04, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

I had noticed. While I've been away from the project I noticed that people don't look at content on our inner pages, and we have a lot of vital stuff there that people don't see to the detriment of our work, so I'm going to revamp our main page and then write out a section of "Tasks you can do". I think there are a lot of people who would like to help, but they don't know how, and if we tap into their resources, we'd be very well off. Btw, did you notice it's Gnome week? :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 15:42, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

????? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:18, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Gnome Week. Seemed right up your street. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 17:22, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

I love it!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:32, 22 June 2007 (UTC)

Dooded you run the bot yet? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 18:10, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Yes. But not on this project. I hope to have time to write it tonight, but it may be tomorrow. Sorry! Busy RL at the moment... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:51, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Sure, take a while. We're all volunteers, after all... :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:33, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

hey, I'm still sorting out WP codes and such and decided to copy your user page archiving botwork. I was going to change colors, at least, but couldn't even sort that out. Tell me if I'm crossing a line or something but I hope you don't care. Benjiboi 08:07, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Not a problem at all! Do you mean the MiszaBot archiving thing? Or the stuff on my front page (SatyrTN in a Nutshell, etc)? If the former, take a look at User:MiszaBot/Archive HowTo. If the latter, the colors may not change that easy. The corners are images, as I think the background is, though I don't remember. Let me know, though, if I can help with anything. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:04, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Just the Mizabot thing. I'm over playing with it, maybe sometime it the future though. Benjiboi 19:29, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, could you modify your bot so that it also tags new untagged articles for WikiProject Environment? The template name is {{environment}}. OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 16:35, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, OhanaUnited! The bot is just finishing up tagging WP:ALABAMA, so it's available for WP:Environment.

To get started, I'll need a list of categories to run through. I don't let it run through subcategories because things can get really messed up that way. So if you could put together something like Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera/Catlist, I can sic the bot on it. The easiest way to do that is to start with the category tree function. Go through and click the pluses and minuses until you have the list of cats you want. Select the text on the page - not the code - and paste it into another page. I should be able to work with that.

Let me know if that doesn't make sense :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:50, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

I'll create a category list (hopefully I'll do it correctly) on tomorrow since it's almost 1am here and I need to finish up a chinese translation request on a japan topic (yes, it sounds weird) that my friend requested more than a week ago. I was putting this request on hold while I'm busying doing all sorts of stuff such as organizing a task force and a portal but I think my friend's patience is running out. I'll let you know when the list is ready. OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 16:59, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

Not a problem - just let me know. I'll be around =) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:42, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

I spotted some problems. While expanding the list, I spotted some irrevalent categories like Category:Communications in Cuba when I open the Carribean category, which is absolutely not related to environment. Do I have to include these ones? OhanaUnited^{Talk page} 06:30, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

The goal is to create a list of categories where at least 80% of the articles in each category do need to have the wikiproject's banner. That way the bot isn't over-tagging tons of articles that don't belong. So when you copy/paste the text, you can delete the ones that don't belong. Glad you caught that :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:33, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Thank you, thank you, thank you!  :) Aleta 17:18, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

NP - glad to help!

I'm going to post on the project talk page about some maintenance options the bot can help with. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:23, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Satyr, there's something very strange going on here. I swear to God I have already added a whole load of these people. Bimbo boy, John Blankenstein, Kutluğ Ataman... I know I found references for all of them, through various computer crashings I did Ataman three times... so where the hell have they gone? Have you noticed anyone removing entries at all? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:10, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Look, Ataman is in the Ab list in this diff, but he's not anymore. Who on Earth removed this sourced entry? How many more have gone? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:27, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

The answer is 13, in case you were wondering. I have no idea why, but I've put them all back. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 23:33, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Surely I didn't delete them when I split the list? I haven't noticed anyone deleting entries, but I can think of at least one week when I wasn't watching. Glad you found them!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:02, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

No, I only pulled out people who were A-B, any C-Es are impossible to find since you've split the list (though you didn't know). It's just a bit odd. I think I will check curs between my edits a bit more often now though.

The Queer Arts Festival doesn't say anything other than she was there; it's conceivable she could be a straight ally from it. TLA releasing is unambiguous, but I'd be wary of adding commercial links: as we learnt from list of male actors in gay porn, that doesn't go down too well, even in a last resort. But I think we can use the Dyke night one, Its' authoritative in relation to the subject at hand, and if you go through the other lesbians mentioned in it, it might be able to account for a few more people on Wikipedia too... Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 09:22, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Now that we have the ongoing updates of categories set, I should reaffirm my interest in the Wikipedia:Bot_requests/Archive_12#Autotagging autotagging features. The most important is to update the GA/FA articles and to autostub. Let me know what your thoughts are on these possibilities. --TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 22:22, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

As I re-do the banner tagging function to take into account {{WikiProjectBannerShell}}, I should be able to build in GA and FA auto-rating. The bot already knows how to auto-rate stubs. Images, cats, and lists shouldn't be hard to add on :) I'll let you know. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 23:02, 14 June 2007 (UTC)

I see the bot is autostubbing now. How are the rest of the features especially GA and FA tagging coming along? TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 16:39, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

Doh! I haven't implemented that yet - I think I'll take a look at it now. Thanks for reminding me! SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:53, 25 June 2007 (UTC)

I am not sure what you mean by you have not implemented it yet. I saw {{ChicagoWikiProject|class=stub}} got added to a talk page by SatyrBot. Do you mean it doesn't autostub articles that already have {{ChicagoWikiProject}} or that you have not implemented the FA/GA stuff? TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 22:05, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

Stub yes, GA/FA no. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:18, 26 June 2007 (UTC)

...for the cleanup at SSM in Spain! :-D I was sooo tired but my organized mind wouldn't let me log off before at least jotting down the info in both es:wiki and here. That's one of the first signs of wikiholism, isn't it? :-P Cheers! Raystorm (¿Sí?) 09:03, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Is it? I wouldn't know. :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:55, 28 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, apparently the source is a book called Crystal Lake Memories, according to the article for Friday the 13th Part VII: The New Blood. On IMDb, a number of users referred to it as matter-of-fact. However, I haven't read the book and don't know enough (e.g. page number) to put a real reference. Eep.~Zythe^{Talk to me!} 20:02, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

When he comes out in The Advocate, we'll add a ref :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:05, 29 June 2007 (UTC)

I noticed you added a film infobox to this article. What is the policy re: infoboxes when an article is about both a play and its subsequent film version? In this instance there isn't enough to say about either to warrant giving them separate articles, so if both the play and film are discussed in one article, why opt for a film infobox rather than a play infobox, especially since the play came first? Thank you. ConoscoTutto 13:32, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Conosco! That's a very good question, and I don't know the answer. I didn't even know there was a "play infobox" :)

Let's see - Love! Valour! Compassion! has all the play information first (as the play came first), then adds the film infobox later when the film discussion starts. That's the only similar example I can come up with, but it seems like a good guideline.

Thanks for your work on the article - and happy editing :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:11, 30 June 2007 (UTC)

Well, I'm on holiday and trying to edit from the library's computers, but I think they must have the word "gay" on their filters or something because I can't access the project, my watchlists or even But I'm a cheerleader. This somewhat disrupts my plan to edit from afar. I will see if I can get access anywhere else, but I think you're going to have to take up the slack. Damn libraries - do you know they charge here for computer facilities as well? It's disgusting. Anyway, I'll see what i can do, but I'm not holding out hope. Very pissed off, Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 10:49, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

Any news on SatyrBot for Project Paranormal? I put in a link to the page with the output on it and want to start transcluding but the bot appears ot have stopped updating on the 16th of July. Which isn't much good for us. Am I linking into the wrong place?

perfectblue 17:43, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

It's updating every night: [10] -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:48, 24 June 2007 (UTC)

I was looking at the wrong page. perfectblue 18:39, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I'm sorry about this. There seems to be a problem with the recently updated Outriggr script. I had noticed a couple of people's monobook pages in the unassessed biography cats, hadn't realised mine was showing up too. I'm not sure how to fix it, I'm not too good with scripts, but I've put a message on the script page, hopefully it will be sorted soon! --Belovedfreak 09:50, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Ooh, thanks very much - that did the trick! And I've suggested it on the Outriggr script page so hopefully others will do it too. Thanks, --Belovedfreak 17:23, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

The categories have to be on the redirect page in this case, because the redirect target Xtra! is not the name of the Vancouver publication; Xtra! West is. Either the categories stay on the redirect, or the redirect is becoming a separate article regardless of its stubbishness, because the title Xtra! West is not to be taken out of the relevant category listings. Please also note that our categorization rules explicitly allow for direct categorization of redirects, in circumstances where the title in a given category has to be something different than the title of the article that's being redirected to. Bearcat 18:13, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Wow. You're quite adamant about this. I'm curious as to why? I can see keeping the Category:Vancouver media on the redirect, but it seems to me as if people looking through any of the other four cats are going to see Xtra!, which is the same page. Thoughts? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:21, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Having only one title in the category gives the false impression that it's one publication, rather than three different publications with three different titles. Category:Canadian LGBT magazines needs to display all three titles separately, because they're three different publications. Each city's dedicated media category needs to contain its own correct local title. The "publications established in (year)" categories need to contain the correct titles since they weren't all established at the same time. And on, and so forth. At any rate, I've now accordingly split them out into three articles. Bearcat 18:45, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Bearcat - that works out well, then :) Thanks for your work on it! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 19:48, 3 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank you so much for helping me out on the LGBT list. :D Alicia4eva 09:12, 5 July 2007 (UTC) Hi, I found another more reliable articl, written by Ralf Euler for German FAZ. Would you so kind and replace the Bild article with that one, please? Thank you very much!!! :D http://www.faz.net/s/Rub8D05117E1AC946F5BB438374CCC294CC/Doc~E69234770793F47379616CF9E850BE5B3~ATpl~Ecommon~Scontent.html Alicia4eva

If that's your intention, to paraphrase Inigo Montoya, I do not think that word means what you think it means.[11] —M (talk • contribs) 12:14, 6 July 2007 (UTC)

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter! Issue VIII - July 1, 2007 Monthly Challenge: Submit an article to our Jumpaclass competition! Languishing unloved, it is a great way to improving that article you always meant to improve but never got round to. Challenge someone else to go head to head and see who can improve their article most! Article News But I'm a Cheerleader is now GA Class! Project News Our Deputy Coordinators have been doing a fabulous job so far. Well done! The portal is now looking very snazzy, well done to Fireplace for all his hard work. The list of LGBT people to be sorted has now beed reduced by 20%. Please help us with it, all of us adding just one person a day would have a dramatic effect! The Core Topics is now largely complete. The original aim of getting some kind of publication out of it is extremely long term - any short term uses we can make of it are welcome on the project talkpage. A suggestion was made this month that we start our own wiki. Although the conclusion was that we felt we were a part of Wikipedia rather than a stand alone organisation, it seems there is an LGBT wiki already, at http://lgbt.wikia.com/wiki/Main_page . Members may be interested in getting involved there. The Collaboration is now getting rather short on suggestions. Article nominations for August through December would be welcome on the talkpage. There is now a list of Missing LGBT Topics. Help is needed to work out which topics can be made redirects or need to be created. Please contribute is you can. An LGBT banner that was created for Wikipedia's internal ads system has now been adapted so it can be placed on blogs and websites. The html is <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:LGBT"><img src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/76/Qxz-ad48.gif" height="53" width="445"></a> Please credit Miranda and link to her userpage: <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Miranda">Miranda</a>. The banner can be seen in action here. If you have a blog or a website, please consider adding the banner, either in a post or as part of your profile. Member News 11 new contributors joined the project in the last month: Xnuala, Samantha Pignez, Jreferee, BGMurph, jmsast, Kukini, Theinsidellama, Heyfoureyes, Iceflow, NickGorton, Lynnllynn, KaiLeo, Amadscientist, and Mad_Cheese_Eater. Please make them feel welcome  ! However, this is a bit low for a project of our standing, so please consider doing a little recruiting if you can. To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please let us know here. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, do let Dev920 know.

Delivered on 16:00, 6 July 2007 (UTC).

If still possible, we'd like to set up the bot maintenance option you outlined on Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Alabama. Looks like a setup similar to what WP:Chicago uses, where the bot periodically runs through the cats and tags new articles will work great for what we're doing. Let us know on the talk page if there's anything you need us to do. Thanks, - auburnpilot talk 00:19, 8 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm a little confused as to what is being asked for. The text does mention a "camp name" with a reference to his autobio, which I think does implicitly broach the subject while also being relevant to the subjects being discussed. It would seem a little out of sort to add a sentence to the effect of saying "oh, and by the way he's homosexual [citation provided]". I understand the fears of controversy re the Seigenthaler precedent, but Watkin's been out of the closet for about four decades and makes it quite obvious in his autobiography.

On another job in Stratford-on-Avon, for some reason the whole unit had dinner together and were ranged on both sides of a long refectory table. I was sitting at about the centre on one side, directly facing the gentleman from the advertising agency, who I noticed had been drinking a little. Suddenly in the middle of dinner he asked if I had any children.

"No."

"Are you married?"

"No."

"Are you queer?"

"Yes."

This shut him up as I'd thought it would and the silence that followed was swiftly broken by my gaffer electrician, Roy Rodhouse.

"Well he don't tell lies anyway."

I remembered from 1943 that interviews conducted across refectory tables were liable to consist of silly questions. So I had landed squarely outside the closet; I had been a half-hearted occupant anyway. -- Watkin, Why Is There..., p. 102-103.

Anyway... Girolamo Savonarola 04:08, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the info, Girolamo! As you noted, WP:BLP requires the information to at least be cited. WP:LGBT has been going through the entire list of LGBT people to make sure they are sourced properly. The above info is perfect. I was thinking of changing the one line to say:

Subsequently, the array was named the "Wendy-light" in his honor — Watkin who is gay — uses the "camp name" Wendy.^[1]

How does that strike you? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 10:00, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

Responded on the article's talk page. DS 01:58, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

• Again, see the talk page. DS 14:56, 9 July 2007 (UTC)

His record label, as already noted in both the previous paragraph and the infobox. Bearcat 03:03, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Heh, no worries, I did something similar myself just a day or two ago. Bearcat 03:16, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

It would be correct to state that she is a female now but in her early life, we refer to her as a boy since she was at the time. Also, it says currently that she wanted a sex change operation, which would make it seem quite confusing. Reginmund 18:39, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Definitely, sounds better, much less confusing. Reginmund 18:46, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi Satyr TN, there was a majority to delete (7-5); and the nominator made a strong argument that the list's purpose could be effectively served through categories, which several voters agreed with. You can find a copy of the list at User:SatyrTN/List of LGBT composers; some of the members of the list didn't get put in Category:LGBT composers, apparently because there was no evidence given at their articles that the composers were L, G, B, or T. I would guess for some of them, evidence can be found--as you know, people often get added to lists without anyone supplying a citation, but that doesn't mean the addition was wrong. Let me know if you have more questions. --Akhilleus (talk) 15:40, 1 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks very much! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:09, 2 July 2007 (UTC)

A fair few were added to the list in error. The ones I did not add were either not gay, or "obviouslY" gay but had no valid reference. The ones I could find refs for have all been added to the LGBT lists. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 09:54, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

Kewl. I have this idea that there should be some substance to back up the list. Something like List of queercore bands, where there's text on the list page, a "main article", etc. Some day. :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:36, 5 July 2007 (UTC)

If you want to write an article on LGBT composition (or perhaps contact Hyacinth about it), with something about the impact of a person's sexuality on their work (which will establish the notability of a list), I will happily construct another, better LGBT composers list, and populate with everyone from the main lists. I think we can both fit that in around, ooh, 2011? :D

Notes to me: [12] [13]

Btw, do you want some rock or some other souvenir from here? Sending it to NH will probably cost a bit, so nothing too heavy. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:20, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Shipping is a bit prohibitive, so no rock for me :) Who's Hyacinth? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:07, 7 July 2007 (UTC)

Hyacinth, said he'd like to be contacted about LGBT music when I spoke to him last. He might be of some help. Btw, I'll just finish off the members list on the newsletter, and then can you send it out? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 12:18, 10 July 2007 (UTC)

Members all done. I've found a nearby bar with free wifi so I'll probably be on a bit more now. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 12:31, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

That makes me happy :) I'm delivering the newsletter now. Would you like to contact Hyacinth? Or should I? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:23, 11 July 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I think as the AfD nominator of the list it would probably be best if I leave that honour to you. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 23:10, 13 July 2007 (UTC)

I started an initial list of stuff here. My apologies for the delay. I think you should add the stuff you've also been doing that doesn't require your bot, because much of this project has been riding on you at the moment and the list should reflect that, I think. Which, btw, I think you are awesome for. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:47, 14 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, on the lists of LGBT people, I've seen glbtq.com listed quite often as a source. Just wondering (in light of the Nigel Slater incident...) do you consider this a reliable source to use? Thanks, --Belovedfreak 00:31, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

What's the Nigel Slater incident? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 10:43, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

See here and then here. --Belovedfreak 18:55, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Ok. Well, from what I've read there, I think waiting for someone to say in an interview "I'm gay" before we can mention that they are is stupid. There are plenty of people who we know are gay who have never explicitly mentioned it, Oscar Wilde, Jeffrey Dahmer, and notoriously Carrie Brownstein until she was spectacularly outed by someone else. And what about all the people who don't see it as a particularly important thing to address, like Evan Davis or Jim Gray? No, a policy in which we only mention a person's sexuality when they have explicitly written or stated they are gay will result in a lot of openly gay and bisexual people being removed from our lists, and it's just not viable. Nigel Slater is an unfortunate case where the journalist was guilty of faulty reporting, not us. We were using reliably third party sources, and it is a statistical fact that sometimes those reliable third party sources are inaccurate; in which case, we remove it and find something else. We don't give up entirely on them, we wouldn't be an encyclopedia at all if we only trusted the subjects of our articles to tell us what they wanted people to know.

On that basis, there is no reason why we shouldn't use GLBTQ.com as a source, where each entry has an quoted author. I generally tend to only quote those entries where the subject was noted to have had same sex relationships or is quoted to be gay by someone else - I've found that some people on GLBTQ.com are assumed to be gay where the evidence is ambiguous, such as Caravaggio. But, like with that book of letters produced by Rictor Norton, there's no need to chuck out the entire source wbecause its author tends to cast the net a bit wide. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 19:32, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

OK, thanks Dev. I was feeling a bit wary of anything that wasn't an explicit "I am gay" quote, but what you say makes a lot of sense, so I will go ahead and use GLBTQ.com as a source. --Belovedfreak 20:35, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Also, GLBTQ usually (if not always) includes a list of sources where *they* get their material from, so I'm pretty confident they're reliable. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:32, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

I love the way that we'r so concerned with the quality of our sources as well as their provision. So few projects seem to care about that. I can see the byline now: "WP:LGBT: one happy fount of sourcingness. Hold the vampires." Very Whedonesque. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 09:19, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

They are both homosexuell and they live their lifes open. Both german politicans do that without any great dicussing..it's getting more and more normal to see gay german politicans...so that's no news in Germany. GLGerman 17:05, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

All I know is that (a) she's categorized that way on de:, and (b) she's linked to from LGBT literature. I don't speak German, so it's hard for me to locate a specific source myself, but perhaps GLGerman can provide one. Bearcat 18:42, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

"...Hi, Entre-Nos! I noticed you added back Category:Drag queens to the article on La Comay. I'm curious how operating a female puppet counts as doing drag? I'm going to remove the category again, since that isn't a standard part of the definition of drag. Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:49, 16 July 2007 (UTC)..."

Hi Satyr! It's ok. No problem. But maybe you don't know that it's not a puppet. It's a man that dresses as a woman and the only thing that's not real is his face. He totally dresses as a woman and uses a fake face(mask) on his head, and talks as a woman. But if doesn't meet the requirements for you, no hassle. Thanks for your concern. No argument about it. Best regards.--Entre-Nos 18:05, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

--Entre-Nos 00:01, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

I was working on a list of U.S. Centers of Population until I found out that you had already almost compiled the same list. Regardless, if you'd like to see the details I came up with (slightly more precise than yours), go to User:Thunderbunny/PopCenter. Thunderbunny 08:22, 17 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the compliment. There's a possibility I'll finish it this weekend, and if I do I'll probably go to the respective town/county pages and edit them with my findings. I considered making a standalone page for it, but I decided against it, for fear it'll get AfD'ed (WP:NOT an indiscriminate collection of information, and this list falls well within the bounds of "totally useless trivia"). So that's that. Thunderbunny 05:39, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Dude, I am suddenly wondering what you look like, do you have a pic anywhere on the web? We cross paths so often I feel like I should have a clear image in my head; so far I think I've been imagining Mr Tumnus, LOL. — TAnthony 05:48, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

ROTFL!! That made me laugh a LOT :) my web album - there's some pictures of me in there somewhere... Enjoy :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:59, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Haha, there is a little Tumnus there, I guess that means your username is a good one. ;) TAnthony 14:52, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

By the way, I did indeed change my mind on Slut Night. TAnthony 14:53, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeh, it's a pretty apt username :) And Benjiboi did a great job! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:55, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Wow, that Guardian article on Chester is really great! Thanks for adding that! --Larrybob 15:09, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

NP - glad to help! Happy editing :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:18, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

I'll contact the guy who published my article on us in their newsletter and see if he'll send us a copy. From the out list it sounds like they're quite amenable to giving it out. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 19:09, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

I've emailed him, I guess it's wait and see right now. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:14, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for your message. The article does look much better and I shall be pleased to revise my response. Regards, --Malcolmxl5 19:14, 18 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the heads up. I've never worked on a wikiproject before. Pygmypony 07:01, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Do you think it might be a idea to create a seperate page on our to be sorted list of people we're fairly certain are gay but have no proof of? And make the search engine bots blind to it (since I've noticed that a fair few people I googled have brought up our to be sorted list!)? Or should we just remove them from the project entirely? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 15:00, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Hm. That's probably a good idea. I just removed the project banner from Lisa Vogel and Jack Wetherall - two people I'm almost certain belong to the project. But I can't find a single ref.

Do you know how to 'bot-blind a page? I don't know how. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:52, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

I have no idea, but it's something to do with this. I'm totally technically retarded, does it make sense to you? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 18:08, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

Hello, this is a message from an automated bot. A tag has been placed on Talk:Donna Sachet, by Dev920 (talk · contribs), another Wikipedia user, requesting that it be speedily deleted from Wikipedia. The tag claims that it should be speedily deleted because Talk:Donna Sachet fits the criteria for speedy deletion for the following reason:

To contest the tagging and request that administrators wait before possibly deleting Talk:Donna Sachet, please affix the template {{hangon}} to the page, and put a note on its talk page. If the article has already been deleted, see the advice and instructions at WP:WMD. Feel free to leave a message on the bot operator's talk page if you have any questions about this or any problems with this bot, bearing in mind that this bot is only informing you of the nomination for speedy deletion; it does not perform any nominations or deletions itself. --Android Mouse Bot 2 19:30, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

...why has it left you that message? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 19:41, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

ROTFL! Because I created the page, of course! I'll leave a note for the bot owner that his code needs some tweaking :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:40, 19 July 2007 (UTC)

The bot is churning out new articles. It is autostubbing new articles. How is the progress on checking articles already tagged with the template for autostubbing, GA status and FA status? --TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 03:05, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

There's been a recent uptick in the number of article talk pages that need WPBS. If you have the time/inclination, take a look at SatyrBot's listing? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:11, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

I did a couple today but will def try to hit the list hard over the weekend. By the way, have you ever thought about coming up with a bot that calculates how many talk pages are using {{WikiProjectBannerShell}} vs. {{WikiProjectBanners}}? I don't know if the Banners guys are as mobilized as we are, and I'm just curious which is the more "dominant" shell at this point. TAnthony 22:23, 20 July 2007 (UTC)

As of this particular moment, the numbers are:

WikiProjectBannerShell = 13054

WikiProjectBanners = 6143

:) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:00, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Heh heh. TAnthony 05:39, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the backlog notice. We may both want to regenerate lists soon; I've taken care of 1000 articles today, assisted by MadmanBot, and I hope to get rid of the other 151 tomorrow morning. I'm turning in with Harry Potter for the night.  ;)

Cheers! — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 06:03, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

I don't know if this is the appropriate place to go. However, is it possible to request for the Styrbot to place the {{logic2}} tags on all the pages that are on this navigation template or perhaps all of the logic category also? Any help appreciated. Be well. Gregbard 07:29, 15 July 2007 (UTC)

Thank you so much! I will put the proposed categories up for a week, so there will be time to discuss which shall be included or not. I be in touch. Be well,Gregbard 08:42, 16 July 2007 (UTC)

Well, it has been a week! It went by fast for me?! It was publicized, but there wasn't much debate about the content of the list. I have the list of categories at the proposal page (same one listed above). There are about a hundred categories listed. I can put them in a different format if you prefer. Be well, and thank you so much for this service. Gregbard 12:44, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Gregbard! That looks just fine! I'm finishing up WP:Illinois right now, which may take another day or two, and then I'll be able to start with this one. If you haven't heard from me by the end of the week, nudge me again :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:39, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

I would like to assist, but this weekend is going to be busy for me. You can turn the bot off if you wish, no sense that it keeps running through the Cubs every night. I am still in shock with the amount of articles that have been found untagged, and there is so many more to go. Thanks for all your help in this.--Kranar drogin 04:03, 21 July 2007 (UTC)

Copying to your other Satyr page also. I have changed some of the categories since there is concern that we have tagged some of the sports teams of Chicago also. Just can you check the Category-Class for an update. I have basically moved all the sports team players to NA instead of Category. You don't have to go and change anything as of right now as far as tags that have been put out already. Things are looking great so far otherwise!--Kranar drogin 23:10, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

"Thanks for your addition to List of lesbian, gay, bisexual, and transgender sportspeople! Would you mind visiting both Ondrej Nepela's and Toller Cranston's pages and adding a sentence (with the same ref) to both of them? They're currently in the LGBT categories, but have no mention of their sexual orientation in their articles. Thanks again! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:21, 25 May 2007 (UTC)"

Sorry about the delay. It completely slipped my mind. I've added it to both their articles. Kolindigo 22:35, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

One of the reasons, according to your edit summary, for removing the prod was that the film won an award. But I see nothing in the article to indicate that. I will keep watching the page but if it doesn't show what award it won, I will consider nominating it for afd. Many films are shown at film festivals and then never seen again. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 172.133.110.41 (talk • contribs) 07:20, 2007 July 24 (UTC)

As a major contributor to the reduction of the backlog of the {{WikiProjectBannerShell}} cleanup project, you may be interested in the most recent task request I have submitted to the BAG for approval. Any questions, comments, or criticism of the bot's methods are invited. If this task is approved, it could go a long way towards keeping the backlog small and manageable. More information is available here. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 03:17, 24 July 2007 (UTC)

Your bot made an error. User: Example is enactive because they don't exist, hence the name example --Alien joe 20:32, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Chill out, man. :P Don't freak out over things like User:Example getting barnstars when there's no contributor with that user name; it's all good fun. In this case, it seems SatyrBot simply read the following line in WP:LGBT/M and parsed it:

<!-- Place your name above this line, using the format:
# {{User|Example}}
-->

Not a problem, as presumably the bot won't do it again. But when reporting a potential bug in a bot's operation, it's a lot more helpful to attempt to determine its cause and give as much information as possible before assailing the bot operator. Just my two cents. — Madman bum and angel (talk – desk) 21:08, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

ROTFL! Thanks for pointing that out, Alien joe! I'll fix the bot :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:29, 26 July 2007 (UTC)

Just so you know, pages like Tefé Holland can't be tagged as dbbio since they're fictional characters. I did put an expand tag on it though. If you don't think this is encyclopedic you could suggest a merge to a more appropriate page. Cheers. :) -WarthogDemon 18:02, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Just so you know, pages like Tefé Holland can't be tagged as dbbio since they're fictional characters. I did put an expand tag on it though. If you don't think this is encyclopedic you could suggest a merge to a more appropriate page. Cheers. :) -WarthogDemon 18:02, 27 July 2007 (UTC)

Hey, Satyr, could you please have a talk of some sort with User:Amadscientist about his/her conduct on the project's talk page? After his/her last comment, I'm really at my wits end as to how to handle this situation. CaveatLector^Talk 07:51, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Sorry - I was out of town this weekend. I'll monitor discussions as I'm able, though! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:49, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

• Hello, SatyrTN, you recently tagged the Bianca Montgomery and Maggie Stone article as Start-Class as of Wikipedia:WikiProject LGBT studies, and I am wondering if you would be kind enough in giving me insight on what needs to be done to improve this article as of WikiProject LGBT studies. I mean, I'm not done with this article, of course, but I thought that it would at least be rated B-Class. But then again, that may be do to my knowing that it would be rated higher by Wikipedia:WikiProject Soap Operas, where articles such as Erica Kane or Damien Spinelli (though I do like how the Damien Spinelli article is formatted, it's) with less real-world information and less-references within the article as compared to the Bianca Montgomery and Maggie Stone article, and is rated B-Class, at least at this time. But I get that different projects of Wikipedia will rate articles differently. So I'm asking for your thoughts on this matter.

Recently, as you may know from having viewed its talk page, the Bianca Montgomery and Maggie Stone article was featured on Wikipedia's main page in the Did you know? section. After it was tagged by a bot as one of the "Good" articles proposed by bot, and Jreferee and Balloonman felt/feel that it was/is a good article, of course, I felt that I didn't have a large way to go in improving the article, but with it being rated Start-Class as of WikiProject LGBT studies, I'm perplexed as to what I need to do to even get it up to B-Class on WikiProject LGBT studies.

The definition of Start-Class on Wikipedia for articles is, as you know, of course: Useful to some, provides a moderate amount of information, but many readers will need to find additional sources of information. The article clearly needs to be expanded.

I'm not sure how much more this article can be expanded, though I do intend to expand it. As for needing to find additional sources, I'm also not sure that more than a few additional sources are needed as this article stands now. It's apparent that I will have to work on making this article good on both the Wikipedia LGBT studies and WikiProject Soap Operas. Flyer22 11:07, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Hey, thanks for the "B" man! That's as good as an A to me, and a helluva lot less hassle . . .  :-) --Textorus 10:21, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

=) Well written and lots of refs - that's good enough for me =) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:24, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Could SatyrBot be programmed to insert new projects into an existing WikiProjectBannerShell? Currently, the bot is loading the project template into the top of the talk page, even if the other projects are currently nested. This leads to a human editor (me, for example) having to nest the new project. Thanks! Stevie is the man! ^{Talk • Work} 14:29, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeh, I know I need to do that. And I need to totally re-write SatyrBot's functioning. As soon as I have some time, I'll be working on it. Sorry for the inconvenience! :( -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:42, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Please stop spamming talk pages with the logic2 tag. Derek farn 09:27, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

The bot owner is not to blame for the categories tagged. The bot is tagging articles by the categories considered at WikiProject Logic. Some articles may not be included. In the interest of getting most of the appropriate ones, the sweep may be a little over inclusive. Besides, some of these articles could benefit from the attention of the project. Anyway that page wasn't the place for this. Be well,Gregbard 10:16, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

I'm doing that interview for SXNews (btw, she said she was interested in maybe getting a few more members involved; could I put your name forward?) and one of the questions has slightly stumped me. Do you think we have faced any other challenges as an LGBT WikiProject besides increased vandalism? I thought of people like EedoBee harrassing us, but can you think of anything else? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:04, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Sure - put my name forward. How about resistance from non-LGBT editors - like "does the fact that so-and-so is gay really belong in their article?" I've seen that a lot. The other thing I've seen is a resistance to correct pronoun usage in transgender articles. That's all I can think of after my second cup :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:07, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Ah yes, of course. All those "sexuality of..." are so silly. Btw, your WikiProject members counting tool seems to have stopped working. You haven't moved it or anything, have you? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:11, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Not that I know of? But I haven't looked at it in forever. What's the url again? I'll take a look. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:16, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

http://www.radiantweb.net/ian/WikiProjectTop20.php . It's a great tool. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:25, 25 July 2007 (UTC)

Hi, guys - just thought I'd remind you I'm still around. What about controlling over enthusiasm? All the fights over insisting that people are only tagged as LGBT if there's a source for that (however much some people think we should leave BLP to "outside interests"). The balance between wanting to expand scope and sticking to reliable info is a pretty interesting challenge IMO. And as he runs the Bot, Satyr has taken a lot of the stick for that. WjBscribe 06:38, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Hadn't forgotten you WJB, just we haven't seen a lot of you lately since you got the bit. All that adminning, it can't be good for you. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:25, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

List of LGB people/A-B is at 308 references, with A almost complete but another 130 Bs to go. Reckon we'd better split it again into /A and /B? Is that going to look silly? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 00:25, 28 July 2007 (UTC)

Yes, it will look silly. But actually, just Thursday, I went through and counted how many people in each section, and A/B far outstrip any other letter. Congrats, btw :) But even if it looks silly, it's worth doing. And "T" will be another big one, so it'll have to be split out eventually. I'd say go for it. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:36, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

K, will do. And then will spruce it up and put it to peer review and try and get it featured. Finally, the next step... Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:38, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Can I ask SatyrBot to tag all Bradford-related articles with the WP:BRAD banner? I've just set up the project and I think it's the quickest way to get the word out about it. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:24, 29 July 2007 (UTC)

Is there a cat of Bradford-related articles? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 04:49, 30 July 2007 (UTC)

Yeah, it's the spectacularly original Category:Bradford. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:36, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Just that cat? I can't let the bot go wandering through sub-cats - it's too likely to get lost and end up somewhere in "India". Or "African-American opera singers of the 21st century". You get the idea :) So if you just want Category:Bradford, I can do it lickity split. If you want a bunch of cats, would you put together something like Wikipedia:WikiProject Logic/Categories? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:02, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

ARGH, I just put together a lovely list and the stupid window just lost half of it. :( Will finish tomorrow. Stupid computers... *kicks hutch* Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:23, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Hey kiddo, hope you're well, etc. I had an idea that might serve the LGBT Wikiproject. Seems like a weekly update brief (wikiwubby?) could be messaged to project members to directly inspire attention to articles that are facing AfD (a 7-day window for voting, I believe) as well as non-AfD articles that need love. Hopefully it would include at least one for L,G,B and T. My hope is that this would make the ominousness of WP and the project a little less overwhelming and utilize the compassion of wanting to help and focus it on some borderline articles that could quickly be helped with a bit of attention. A note stating "needs sources cited" or something that gives specific action needed could be added. Each week the non-AfD articles would be different so if there is no interest in the current one they might be in the following issue. A link could be added for the project page or whatever seems most needed. Benjiboi 00:01, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

...So, a weekly newsletter instead of a monthly one? Damn, we haven't written August's one... Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 00:35, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

I'd be in favor of an opt-in WP-wubby - say a few lines like:

L: Edith Eyde (expand) G: AIDS advocacy (references)	B: Bloomsbury Group (neutrality) T: Suporn Watanyusakul (wikify)
Articles currently up for deletion discussion: Jamey Heath, BloomingOUT, Acault

(this is just an example - many of those articles don't really need the attention I've indicated).

Especially if it were collapsed by default.

The issue that I see is that we've barely gotten a grip on the current category list. We'd have to break it down into the four categories (with some overlap, probably - I mean, Pride would go in all four, right?). That's a major undertaking. But if the cats were broken up, then I'd be all for it. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:35, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

We wouldn't have to do the four article L, G, B, & T thing necessarily; as you point out, some things would apply to all four, others two, three... Just so long as we made sure that none were being neglected in favor of the others - and we have enough members with enough different areas of interest/expertice that I think we could do that. Aleta 03:46, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

To me the goal is to get more editors empowered to make a difference. I'm no wonky genius but...using the articles currently tagged as needing help starting with ones currently tagged. We could hot-list in some way to be proactive from keeping them out of the AfD process. Also, I wouldn't collapse it but it could be made collapsible. I don't see it as replacing the newsletter - more a tool to involve those interested in the project but not that actively involved in the day to day process currently. Benjiboi 04:11, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

So maybe, as a suggestion, rather than a "delivered" weekly thing, we have a "template" that people can add where they like - their user page, their talk page, whatever. And a group of three or four people that will weekly update both a selection of up to four articles (good idea there, Aleta) and the AfD list. How does that sound? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:05, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

I think it would be mucho less effective. When I get a message on my talk page I read it. Static items are readily ignored. And if someone is gone for more than a week they still only get one prompt for messages. If we keep it neat and concise I think the issues would be minimized. I do have issues with issues. Benjiboi 05:12, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Compromise: Deliver a template (with instructions) that editors can then keep, move or delete. TAnthony 05:22, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Some people don't check in as much as we do, a weekly delivery could become very disruptive. If an ongoing delivery is end result, I suggest a monthly one instead (separate from any regular newsletter), perhaps in conjuction with the Collab of the Month. TAnthony 05:24, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Actually, if it's a template, we can either subst: deliver it or people can add it statically. How's that for compromise!?!? :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:27, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Indent reset. Two things. Wubby needs to go every week to directly support articles that are in the AfD pipeline. If it's a template and someone's gone for a period of time wouldn't they only get the last version (or can it be set up that way).Benjiboi 05:44, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes, they'll only see the latest version. But since any older AfDs will have closed... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:46, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

If they only see the latest version then they'll only see the latest AfDs which are the ones that are in need. Benjiboi 05:55, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Hunh? If an AfD is completed, the article is either kept or deleted - either way it doesn't need as much attention as one that might be deleted if it's not improved - which is what current AfDs are. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:02, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

If we are able to message a template then replace that one with a new one the following week then only current AfDs would be visible.Benjiboi 06:17, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh - I see! What I said above was "subst:" the template - that basically puts the current one there and it doesn't change when the template does. So if a person has three wubbies on their talk page that have been "substed", they'll all be different. Does that sound like what you're saying? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:20, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Think of it as this week's memo of articles needing (wubby) love. Last weeks articles are so old news I really should only be thinking of the current ones rather than trying to catch up. If I'm gone for a week or a year I should only see the current wubby. If we find that we need to nuance it we could list two articles for each L,G,B,T and even a general one or whatever seems to work as long as the AfDs are also included as those articles are most at risk. Benjiboi 06:29, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

On an unrelated note, Satyr you take a lot of crap for your bot's doing exactly what it was told to do, with the choices having been made by other people... Aleta 03:46, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Yes. It's one of the "joys" of being a bot owner. I need to write a sarcastic piece about that :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:05, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Where are you all gettng the word wubby from? What's it mean? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 06:07, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

weekly update brief (wikiwubby?) Benjiboi 06:17, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

See the third sentence in this section - "weekly update brief (wikiwubby?)" Cute, eh? :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:17, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh, I didn't associate the two as being related. But yeah, sounds great, whatever format it eventually comes in. Let's delay the next newsletter until we can add something about ze wubby in it. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 06:41, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

I've just expanded this article from about 3,000 to 13,000 bytes (if I read the numbers rightly). See if you think it deserves upgrading from Stub class, will ya? I don't know whether significant expansions show up on anybody's automated lists or what.  :-) --Textorus 05:49, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Nah - to my knowledge, no one watches articles to see if they should be upgraded. I'd say that one was very good! You might ask Raystorm to peer-review it, since sie worked hard on the FA Same-sex marriage in Spain and would know how articles like that one can be upgraded to GA or better. Nice job!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:53, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks, appreciate ya!  ;-) --Textorus 07:03, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Will be delighted to, as soon as I come back from my holidays. :-) Raystorm (¿Sí?) 09:20, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

The major problem is categorization itself. First, there is a googd deal of confusion between philosophical logic and mathematical logic. They must be clearly separated. Second, somehow the whole theory of algorithms landed into logic. Logic per se is a very narrow field of research (in boith senses). At the same time "logic" is very fundamental notion, and the whole mathematics may be placed under "logic" (what am I saying? the whole science and a good deal of pseudoscience is logical reasoning). Therefore before running any bots ojn this category its tree must be thoroughly inspected. Ive seen some talks in Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Mathematics `'Míkka 21:20, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

Wait until mathematicians figure out the structure of categories. `'Míkka 21:29, 31 July 2007 (UTC)

There is a discussion being publicized currently:

• Discussion about the fact that the bot has stopped tagging articles due to complaints.

Gregbard 01:49, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks - I've added that page to my watchlist. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:22, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi Satyr! As you can see in the link above, there seems to be a consensus against continued tagging of WikiProject Logic for the original list of categories. Is there any way we can get a list of the categories that have already been tagged, to see if these should be untagged (be it automatically or manually)? Again thanks for your help, --Zvika 19:04, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Nice of you to make a decision for the whole group in a couple of days. It has taken you less time to contact your buddies and have them chime in negatively, than the whole two weeks of it being considered in the first place.

Holding a whole project hostage is a pretty disgusting thing to do. No compromise either. Gregbard 21:07, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

For the record, I have never before met any of the other people involved in the current discussion there. I did notice the comment above by User:Mikkalai (whom I have never met before either) and left a comment on his page asking him to join the discussion at WikiProject Logic (which he hasn't). I realize that you feel like we are all against you, but really and truly we all just want what is best for WP, just like you. Please, try to keep cool and assume good faith. --Zvika 07:02, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Found him on the list of questionably sourced people. Turns out he was sourced okay, but a very minimal article for this pivotal figure in British gay history. I couldn't resist the temptation to punch it up a bit, but it's way late here and I've just done a halfass job with it. Still, might be worth upgrade to Start-class; certainly no more than that. See what you think. --Textorus 09:14, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Awesome! I've updated it to Start. You know, you can upgrade them yourself... I do all the time. I bring in other opinions if I'm not sure about what rating it should have. Be Bold! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:07, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh. Well, that simplifies things considerably, then. I was thinking somebody else had to evaluate on behalf of the project. So does that mean this stuff won't be on the final exam, either? lol  :-) --Textorus 16:51, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

ROTFL!!! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:17, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Nice job filling out the meat on the American Library Association page. Thanks. If you think it relevant for the article, there is a picture of Barbara Gittings at an ALA convention in or about 1970 in what was called something like a lesbian kissing booth. See a Google image search [14] and specifically this picture [15] To be clear, I am a critic of certain limited (but nationally effected) policies of the ALA, but with regard to the present matter, this is just a matter of history, wikiworthy history. --LegitimateAndEvenCompelling 21:23, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Davodd!

I'm considering putting Gay icon up for peer review and possible GA status. I'd love to hear your thoughts on it? I've just gone through it and done some cleanup work and think that everything except the criticism section is looking pretty good. Criticism needs some more content, though. Any other thoughts? Thanks! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:35, 1 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, it couldn't hurt - and the page has gotten much better than it was when it started. Even if it doesn't pass, you will get good critical observations from a fresh perspective. I think the biggest struggle you are going to have is with In entertainment since neither GA nor Peer Review like long lists due to their poor prose. They will suggest that it be re-written in paragraph form. I have the scars of former GA and Peer Review efforts myself to know that one. ;-) - Davodd 21:50, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

If you think it's good enough for a GAC, why not go just a little bit further and take it to FAC? Not you know, that I hate the GA process from the depths of my heart and think it's a waste of everyone's time... But anyway, FA is always the way to go. You'll want to take it there eventually, so why not now? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 23:17, 2 August 2007 (UTC)

Baby steps... baby steps... I've done 1 (count 'me - one) GA. Ever. And I didn't even write most of this article - just some cleanup. So I want to start small, take the suggestions and see where it goes. I'm just not an accomplished WPmaster like some people I know. ;) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 08:02, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

You know, I've only ever written one GA too. He made FA a month later, which is what made me think that it wasn't worth waiting around for one reviewer to look through it. The thing about GA, is that you list it, and then you have to wait around for up to a week, two weeks, for a single person to come along and give his thoughts on it. If you submit to FAC, you get feedback within hours, and usually about four people casting their eye over it. And of course, the article reaches a higher standard faster. If you put four hours into fixing up an article for GA, and then four hours going back through the article to fix it up for FA, but only five hours working on it if you ignored the GA standard and began an FAC straightaway, then it saves a lot of time, and a lot of potential frustration. But hey, do it the long way this time around, get the baby steps in, just think about skipping it next time, ay? Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 10:32, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

Looks good, but there seems to be real problems with citations. Lots of evidence for all the people mentioned as gay icons, which is good, but assertions like "In Beckham's case, it is his combination of athletic prowess, good looks and flamboyant private life;" and "One problem with classifying such people as gay icons is that the line separating those who are simply popular because they possess a talent or an indefinable charm or charisma from those who are political or tragic figures may be a thin one.", which sounds like OR unless there's a citation for it. The entire "in fiction" section is unreferenced. "A prominent gay icon in many rural areas of England has been the much-loved Anthony Hall, who has helped many people to embrace their sexuality." needs to be both referenced and disambiguated - I have no idea which Anthony Hall this is.

There are several short one sentence paragraphs that ought to be expanded or merged, for example the Oscar Wilde sentence (to which incidentally, you may wish to add Stephen Fry's comment when being made honorary patron of the Oscar Wilde society, "It is November as I write this and I am wearing a red poppy in my lapel. In my heart, however, I wear always a green carnation in honour of Oscar the magnificent, Oscar the glorious, Oscar our friend." [16]") The "in sport" section could probably be expanded with more gay icons (why on Earth is Justin Fashanu not included, for example? Is John Amaechi a gay icon?) and stuff on the homophobic attitude of sport which makes those who are out more iconic for those who are still closeted, or something like that. :) What about gay martyrs, like Matthew Shepard?

The lead needs fixing, it currently defines gay icon when it should be summing up the entire article. Maybe start a new short section at the top defining it and explaining what the significance is being a gay icon (being "embraced by the community"? What does that mean? Does that mean we all dress up as them, or write heartbreaking letters to them about our lives or just buy all their stuff or what?). All refs go after a punctuation point, Madonna's brother is gay, which is probably relevant to her attitude towards gays, and the prose is slightly awkward in some cases and could do with an external copyeditor. Ok, I think I'm done. :) Good luck! Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 11:09, 3 August 2007 (UTC)

List of gay, lesbian or bisexual people/U-Z is complete, isn't it? Cos I think you should nominate it after /A passes, you did most of the work on it. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 17:19, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Hunh. You think so? I'll give it a shot! Maybe I'd better read /A to make sure I've got it set up okay. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:21, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

Kewl - just some formatting things, it looks like. Let me know when it passes - or I guess I'll see it on my watchlist. BTW - thanks for the above peer review! I'll get on that in a bit. Much appreciated! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 17:25, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

The LGBT director cat was sourced in the edit summary when I added the cat. Is that not sufficient? Must it be in the article text, even just for a category? Thnaks, Shawn in Montreal 22:53, 4 August 2007 (UTC)

I forgot to mention: I also left a link to the supporting article on the McLaren article talk page. Would that not be sufficient? Shawn in Montreal 03:34, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, Shawn! Nope - that's not sufficient, only because your average WP reader doesn't even know the edit summaries or history is there. No worries - I'll take a look and add the ref to the text. Thanks for writing! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:58, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

You may be interested in this bot request; you also may not be, considering how project tagging has been in the past. I don't blame you either way.  ;)

Unrelated query: How's adding project banners to {{WikiProjectBannerShell}} going? Do you need a hand with the code? — madman bum and angel 17:55, 5 August 2007 (UTC)

I've left you a note there... The Rambling Man 08:12, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

I corrected the errors that were causing the article to populate the articlehistory error category. [17] [18] The instructions for the template are at {{ArticleHistory}}. Regards, SandyGeorgia (Talk) 16:50, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Oh! Sorry about that! I'm a doofus. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:53, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

Why did you take the LGBT writer tag off her article? "Lives with her wife Delia Sherman" ought to be a clue, even if you don't know Ellen. --Orange Mike 14:36, 6 August 2007 (UTC)

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20112084/site/newsweek/ — Preceding unsigned comment added by Silvestris (talk • contribs) 10:58, 2007 August 8 (UTC)

But don't you think inhabitant has the connotation of someone currently living in the town? I think maybe something like Inhabitants (Past and present) would be the best. cheque_some 01:59, 8 August 2007 (UTC)

No, loons are the family and genus, but the species are the Common Loon, White-billed Loon, Red-throated loon etc. The confusion arrises because over most of the range where people encounter loons there is one species, the Common Loon, which most people simply refer to as a loon. Sabine's Sunbird talk 02:31, 9 August 2007 (UTC)

Eccles is gay, he has finally left his wife and come out. It's a short appearance - whilst he is one of the chief characters in Rabbit Run - but it still holds significance.Zigzig20s 06:39, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Well, each page on a novel should have a character section, with each character's name and some info on them. That's what I try to do for books I've read of late, or when I create a page. Unfortunately, many pages don't have that, but...according to the guidelines from the WikiProject Novels, they should. I somehow come to believe that a category is better, although that is my personal opinion. Also, I would recommend creating the list before removing the category - if it ever gets created.Zigzig20s 06:57, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

OK, smarty-pants, I added the characters from the few novels in the category to List of dramatic television series with LGBT characters, orphaned the category and put it up for speedy delete. ;) TAnthony 13:59, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

I disagree. If anything, nothing says that there are lgbt characters in this novel for instance Rabbit Redux. At least the category was a hint. Of course, the page itself should be expanded with a character section, but as it is a work in progress - like many other wikipedia pages on novels - that was better than nothing imo. Don't you think?Zigzig20s 15:13, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Yeh, we really should have "List of LGBT characters in written fiction" or something like that. I'm feeling swamped with living people right now, but if I get a chance, I'll see what I can do. I like the format of List of dramatic television series with LGBT characters, though we won't need the "network" or "actor" columns :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:20, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Isn't this the same thing? -FateSmiled&DestinyLaughed 16:37, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Wikipedia:WikiProject_Judaism would love to take you up on your very generous offer. If I give you Category:Judaism will the bot recursively do everything in that category too or do I need to enumerate each category? --Bachrach44 22:58, 10 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the LGBT project tag on the Davina Kotulski article. She looks notable enough for a good small biography of a living person on Wikipedia, and inclusion in a project, hopefully, will see that the article gets the necessary attention. KP Botany 06:34, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

NP - You put her in the cat, and my bot lets me know which articles are in "our" cats that don't have the banner. Simple, no? :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:37, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Hey SatyrTN. You made a couple of changes to this article which I disagreed with. Could you check back and see if my explanations satisfy you? If not, maybe we could try to find a compromise.NoahB 00:30, 7 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for the reference clean up. Much appreciated.NoahB 03:06, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Glad to help - we're all here to make it better :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:08, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Keep up, Satty. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 22:49, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

ROTFL! Goodness - How in the world am I supposed to keep up with *everything*?!? :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:51, 11 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! Right, your turn now. :) On Jacques Teyssier, to be honest, I don't know. We have an article on Joe Solmonese but I've seen several high ranking organisation members get redirected towards their organisation. What might be a good idea is if we asked some of our german and french members if they know of him or have seen him in the news. He's just not going to show up on our radar. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 08:58, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I see you are very activity on LGBT topics and know WP rules too. I posted this to someone running for administrator (Crockspot) and it got erased so I posted again a few places. Are these questions allowed?

Optional questions from Bmedley Sutler

15. I saw on your home Wikipedia userpage that you are a member of a group called Conservative Underground, so I went there. It is a disturbing site with a lot of hate, against many groups but mostly Gays and Liberals, IMO. I looked at some of your posts. I fear that you maybe aren't right to be an administrator when you make homophobic claims like : "Pretty much any dude with "bear" in his handle you can assume takes it up the ass." Link. Could you explain that claim a little more? Isn't that pretty homophobic? And this one "I've noticed what seemed like an organized, or at least coincidentally coordinated, effort on Wikipedia to scrub any citations of Bill O'Reilly criticizing liberals. They pull every possible justification for it out of their asses, like "O'Reilly not a notable person", "spam links", "O'Reilly is not a reliable source, neither is Fox News.", etc. ad nauseum." Is that a canvassing? The O'Reilly Soros thing was one of your biggest battles Link Another thread called "Fags and Firearms" that you posted in is full of homophobic hate. Is that the sort of NPOV we need from an administrator? Will you keep posting homophobic hate there if you become an administrator? Is your possible homophobia the reason you have fighted so hard to keep claims of homosexuality from the Matt Drudge article? Thank you.

Bmedley Sutler 07:13, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm not an expert on RfA's - haven't been through one and only voted on a couple. But here's my opinion... User:Tbeatty seems to have removed the question because it's very difficult to attribute a user here (Crockspot, for instance) with a user on another site (on CU, for instance). That being said, other editors have also made the connection, so I feel your questions are valid. But I'm just an editor, so what do I know :) You might catch the ear of an admin - say User:WJBscribe - and see what they say. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:29, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. here is what his Wikipedia user home page says User:Crockspot: "I am a regular contributor at Conservative Underground under the same user name" Here is the link to the posts "Fags and Firearms" I left it off at first. Link There is too much Homophobia in the world and specially in America already. We don't need administrators who think making claims about "taking it up the ass" is okay. (IMO) I will see what happens before contacting WJscribe. Good night. Bmedley Sutler 09:31, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Some interesting answers... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 13:28, 14 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your welcome.

Tovojolo 17:17, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Looks ok to me, and if there's anything wrong I'm sure they will tell you. :) Oh, and get on the IRC channel, we need you to make a quizbot. :D Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 17:45, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

On 16 August, 2007, Did you know? was updated with a fact from the article glbtq.com, which you created or substantially expanded. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently created article, then please suggest it on the Did you know? talk page.

--Carabinieri 01:10, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Re unsourced category: I've expanded the bio with refs. Gordonofcartoon 23:58, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks! I've formatted the refs a little different - I hope that's okay. I've also added her to the LGBT WikiProject and to the list of LGBT people. Thanks for your help! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:57, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks also. I've changed ref 3 to the format Rictor Norton specifies. There's a lot more in the ODNB about her drawings and sculpture; I'll get on to that a.s.a.p. Gordonofcartoon 02:28, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

31% We've broken a third! YAY!!!!!! Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:39, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Umm... Dev... You're like an English or History major, aren't you? 1/3 = 33.33333...% -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:42, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Theology. Most of us can't count. Otherwise that whole 3 gods in 1 thing Christianity's got going on would have been shot down years ago. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 14:49, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Ah! Thus the whole angel/pin conundrum. I get it :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:01, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

I know you are very busy doing good work all over wiki but the source mentions at least two affairs. [19]

"her love affair with the daughter of the Turkish Ambassador in Teheran, provoked a scandal".

" A scandalous love affair with the woman archeologist Hackin had left Schwarzenbach forbidden to travel in the excavations of Turkmenistan"

(I wish they could say those sorts of things about me!)

If I had time I would incorporate more information into the article - in the hope that someone would decide to write about her at length. A gift as a subject for a biography. NIghtjar 15:18, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Doh! Missed that part - thanks :) I'll try to add a sentence to the article. Thanks!

And one day they'll say such things about me, too (grin) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 15:25, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

The issues are summarized in Wikipedia:Citing sources: "Scrolling reference lists should never be used, because of issues with readability, accessibility, printing, and site mirroring. Additionally, it cannot be guaranteed that such reference lists will display properly in all web browsers."

Additionally, there's a reason why {{scrollref}} was deleted. And it was most certainly NOT so that it would be duplicated via inline HTML. Circeus 20:31, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

The bot is continuing to make me look like a hard worker. I was wondering if there is any progress on User_talk:SatyrTN/Archive_6#Other_features FA/GA tagging for articles with {{ChicagoWikiProject}}. Moe Berg, which has been a WP:FA since 2005-04-30, just got its tags cleaned up on 2007-08-12 even though User:SatyrBot tagged it for us on 2007-04-26. This made me wonder.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 17:22, 15 August 2007 (UTC)

Looks like you were a hard worker! There weren't that many to be done. Let me know if it looks like I missed anything. I ran the bot to look for articles that a) were tagged with a stub template b) were featured articles, or c) were good articles. I then checked the banner to see if one of those classes needed to be added, where I did so. I'll take a look at the other features, but to tell you the truth, my programming time is limited at the moment. Sorry to take so long to get back to this!!!!! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 02:50, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the update. Judging by this edit it worked. What are you doing to determine whether an article is a FA or GA. I am wondering whether the algorythm is catching everything. I have got to think that there are more out there other than Nancy Reagan and Ernest Hemingway that we have missed. It seems to have found articles based on the status in the {{ArticleHistory}}. Does it also look for {{GA}} tags that may not have been incorporated into {{ArticleHistory}}?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 23:49, 16 August 2007 (UTC)

• For FA, the bot looked for {{Featured article}} on the article page.
• For GA, the bot looked for any category with the phrase "GA-Class" on the talk page. So if any WikiProject had rated the article GA, it would catch it, since almost all of them add something like Category:GA-Class Chicago articles to the talk page.

• For Stubs, the bot looked for any of the Stub sorting tags. Actually, I think I just caught an error in my programming, so I'm re-running to see if there are any extra stubs I missed (I think there are many).

-- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 01:48, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

Hunh. Only five more. User:SatyrBot/Logs. So I think your project is as up-to-date as the bot can make it without serious coding :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 20:40, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

The bot is certainly off to a good start. However, it missed the following, which means we should rethink its logic because there are probably several other articles out there Gustavus Franklin Swift, Fall Out Boy & The Reputation and Joseph W. Tkach.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 21:32, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

I would suggest having the bot check the {{ArticleHistory}} for |currentstatus=FA, FFA/GA, FL, or GA. This would have caught Tkach, Fall Out Boy, and Swift. It should also check for {{GA}} this would have caught The Reputation. HTH.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 21:41, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Tony, I don't know what to tell you. The bot really isn't designed for comparing classes, or even for determining classes, other than "stub". I'm afraid I've done all I can do for WP:Chicago at this point. If I get a chance to work on the bot more to make it more useful for this kind of project, I'll let you know. And you might check with User:Madman to see if MadmanBot is more suited. I don't have the time or inclination to get it working fully for this project, since I really have to spend some time rewriting the entire engine. Sorry I couldn't help more! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 02:04, 19 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your tremendous work to date. --TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 20:39, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome to the LGBT studies project. Please see my comment the talk page there about the hate crimes project I'm engaged in. I'm concerned about continuing the project on Wikipedia. TerranceDC 15:21, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

I noticed you were a frequent editor to Schoolhouse Rock! and I know you are a very experienced editor as well. Can you give me any insight into why the episodes section heavily links to what appears to be a copyvio lyrics site and has done so for such a long time? WP:COPYRIGHT is pretty clear that those links are unacceptable. Thanks, AUTiger » talk 15:59, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Hm - I don't really know... -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:06, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Well then, I'll be removing them as soon as I can figure out an efficient way or get the energy to do the brute-force manual removal. AUTiger » talk 21:12, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, please see Wikipedia_talk:WikiProject_LGBT_studies#Questions_about_Notability.2C_Etc. Benjiboi 23:23, 20 August 2007 (UTC)

With all the work you do to help us with our quality/priority tracking you may want to come cast a vote at Wikipedia:WikiProject_Chicago/Assessment#Current_Top-importance_Candidates.--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 01:25, 21 August 2007 (UTC)

The problem is, he sounds just like Robert Baden Powell - completely uninterested in women, intense male friendships, but in this case he goes one further and actually writes novels on LGBT themes. I really don't know what to do with him. Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 08:44, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

I hear ya - frustrating!!! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 14:29, 22 August 2007 (UTC)

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter

The LGBT studies WikiProject Newsletter! Issue IX - September 1, 2007 Message from Coordinator: It's been almost two months since the last newsletter came out, so there are a fair few people who haven't really been kept up with our project. I'd like to welcome all those who have joined and those who have returned, and strongly reccommend that you use the talkpage for any queries or problems you have. Happy editing! Article News The ongoing effort to create a comprehensive list of LGB people has begun to bear fruit - /A AND the /W-Z lists have been featured! Congratulations to Dev920 and SatyrTN who nominated them respectively. Please consider pitching in the the remaining lists to help us get them finished before the end of the year. Project News WP:LGBT now has an IRC channel! It is #LGBTProject on Freenode. Users without IRC or Xchat can use the java app at java.freenode.net to access the channel from their web browser. Hope to see you in there sometime! David Shankbone has taken a LOT of photos. An idea has been mooted to create a page for listing people who are willing to take images in their area on request, please give your thoughts here. Considerable discussion has recently been held on our coverage of same sex marriage, civil unions and domestic partnerships. You may be interested to read it. The list of LGBT people to be sorted has now been reduced by over 30%. Please help us with it, all of us adding just one person a day would have a dramatic effect! A gay cabal conspiracy ghost has been created to do with what you will. :) Member News Since the last newsletter was released, we have had more members been labelled inactive than who have signed up - please consider recruiting a few more people if you can, a WikiProject is only as good as its members. :) To stop receiving this newsletter, or to receive it in a different format, please let us know here. If you have any news or any announcements to be broadcast, do let Dev920 know.

Delivered on 16:00, 6 July 2007 (UTC).

Yeah I know it doesn't appear at the article, which profoundly irks me. I just finished the novel two days ago. There is a major lesbian character (Sirkin) and several pages about same-sex atraction and homosexuality. In fact, this is the third book of a trilogy, and the sole reason I didn't stick the banner on all three was because even though this character appeared on all, there was no real focus on her homosexuality until the third book. I did explain at my edit summary my rationaly for adding the banner, but as for when I'll be able to add the info to the article... I don't know which cat would be relevant (do we have a sci-fi novels with LGBT content cat?). :-) Cheers Raystorm (¿Sí?) 20:33, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

I imagine that a gay character does not gay literature make... I imagine we'll think of something. ;-) Tried our new IRC channel yet? Raystorm (¿Sí?) 21:09, 17 August 2007 (UTC)

No - I'm a bit scared of IRC. For a while (in my younger years) I spent WAAAAAYYY too much time on chat programs, so now I'm a bit leery :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 00:15, 18 August 2007 (UTC)

Then use Java.freenode.net and just hang out with us. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 21:52, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Could you please look at Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Homosexuality in women's sports discussion close? Seems to me in might not have been a strong keep but a no consensus seems not quite right. Benjiboi 02:53, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Either way the article is kept, so I don't think it matters? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 03:54, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

I'm not sure, that's why I was asking, does it matter? Benjiboi 18:47, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

Nah - the article is still kept. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 18:53, 23 August 2007 (UTC)

I wonder if you could inform us if there is any bot which can help us to make an automatic to-do list of all articles mentioning "discovered in", "created by", "descending from", "first coined", "first discovered", "has its origins", "was created", "was founded" or "by first time" without been followed by a citations or reference. It is for WP:TIMETRACE. We will appreciate very much any help with this. Thank you Daoken 21:50, 24 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi there. I dropped by the article and noted your request for a source for the LGBT Actors category. I've provided a citation from Andrea Olmstead's Juillard: A History, which mentions Azito's cross-dressing right after Houseman's exasperated quest for more "strong, heterosexual boys" in the acting program. Don't know if that's sufficient or not, but, to my knowledge, it's all that's available. Lector —The preceding signed but undated comment was added at 19:08, August 26, 2007 (UTC).

Satyr, can you please, please, please, get in #LGBTProject sometime? I want to talk to you about building a tool, but it's complicated and if I can specify it in real time it'll save us lots of back and forth emails. :) Dev920 (Have a nice day!) 16:56, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

Hi, I create a article who was deleted, It was okay that it was deleted, but I think that the information could be used in a another article, there is anyway that I may get the info back? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Tharal (talk • contribs) 20:08, August 27, 2007 (UTC)

I believe that any admin can retrieve deleted articles. What I suggest is going to the page that was deleted - for instance, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PageZZZ. There should be something there that says "This article was previously deleted. The deletion log for this page is provided here for convenience:" Then it will list the admin who deleted the page. Click on their "talk" link and ask them to provide you with a copy in your user-space. That should do it! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:21, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Since I just started my "Bwjs" page, please get rid of my other two old pages I used to use, John Doh (moved from Jon Doh) and Tawniz since I have nothing to do with them anymore. Thank you very much. I appreciate it a whole lot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by Bwjs (talk • contribs) 15:33, August 27, 2007 (UTC)

Hi. I've just noticed that the two 'To do' lists at Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera/To-do list and Wikipedia:WikiProject Opera/Small to-do list are empty. I wonder if there is a way of reactivating them? Thanks. -- Kleinzach 00:17, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

They just refilled tonight :) There was a bug last week, which caused them to be empty. I fixed it the next day, but your lists only run once a week - so today was the day! :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 06:47, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks. BTW we seem to be getting some non-opera stuff in the small list but not the main one. Bit strange so I thought I'd mention it. -- Kleinzach 07:39, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Hey SatyrTN, thank you for formally welcoming me to the Project. Just let me know if I can be of any more assistance. - Gilliam 05:33, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Okay fair enough, I'll take a look :) - Gilliam 05:39, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Daunting, but every entry helps :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 05:41, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

Ja, LGBT-Aktivist und Zionist? Also alles klar. 74.129.43.130 07:23, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Both {{WikiProject Chicago}} & {{ChicagoWikiProject}} generate the WP:CHICAGO banner. Might the bot miss one or the other?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 06:53, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

It shouldn't - the bot is pulling articles based on the fact that they're in a category on your list, not based on there being a template. You mean for automatically adding the banner, right? -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 07:00, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

That is the main concern. What about with FA/GA checking and autostubbing?--TonyTheTiger (t/c/bio/tcfkaWCDbwincowtchatlotpsoplrttaDCLaM) 21:36, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

I believe it's auto-adding the Stub tag when appropriate, though I don't think it's checking for FA or GA. It doesn't look like I'll be adding that functionality in the near future, but I'll see what I can do. -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:42, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Satyr, I removed Category:American Jews from the bot list because it is not appropriate for WikiProject Judaism tagging. I already had removed it from the main list. Category:American Jews contains many entries about people who are Jewish and American, but by and large are not significant to Judaism. If it should be removed from the list in a different way than I did, please do that. --Eliyak T·C 21:29, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks - I wasn't sure until I saw a couple other of your posts if you meant to do that or were just cleaning up a category :) I'll take it out (again) :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:36, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the welcome ! Can you tell me how to get involved ? I went to the Collaboration page but nothing seems to be going on. Are people just, like, apathetic ? I want to get involved.

Vonita 23:23, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Thank you for your words of welcome. I am interested in literature so I think LBGT writers, novelists, poets, dramatists should be fun !

Vonita 07:46, 30 August 2007 (UTC)

De Luna belongs in the "gay artist" category and I believe that means he belongs in the "LGBT people from the United States" category. What is a "BLP violation". I modeled this entry on many other gay artist wiki's to keep it consistent. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Tobyspinks (talk • contribs) 09:44, 2007 August 28 (UTC)

Hi, Toby! BLP stands for Biographies of Living People. What it means is that Wikipedia has to be even more careful about information on living people than people who have passed on. So if any information in a person's article could be considered controversial, it has to be properly sourced and referenced.

You and I may not consider Robert De Luna's sexuality to be controversial, but unfortunately policy says that it is.

What that means is that for De Luna to stay in the "Gay artists" category, we've got to have some reliable source that says he's gay. Books and news/magazine articles are perfect sources. His official website isn't as good a source, but it works. If you know of one of those, let me know either here or on the article's talk page (or add it yourself to the article) and we'll all be good.

Thanks for writing - and happy editing! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:41, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Just as a PS - when you add a comment to a user's talk page, it's best to use the "+" link at the top of your screen, or to add it to the very bottom. And when you're finished writing, you can "sign" your post with four tildes - type "~~~~" and it turns into something like: SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 16:41, 28 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks SatyrTN. De Luna is referenced in Blade magazine which is a gay publication that writes about gay events and openings in New York City. It doesn't reference his gayness but his inclusion in this magazine pretty much "outs" him. Just as an FYI: I've noticed on other wikis (Bruce Weber the photographer for example who is happily married but rumored to be gay) that the gay artist category is mentioned without a reference and while I know it's not good to point fingers and say "they aren't doing it why do I have to" I am going to say it anyway. This is a relatively small artist who I happen to know personally though his gallery owner Peter Halpert as gay. I am now adding the Blade reference which should be sufficient to out him. I will use the "+" link from now and and also the tildes. Could you please respond to me by using my talk page in the future (which will be easier when I use the tildes I'm sure). There is no action point at this time. Tobyspinks 19:14, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

I removed the unsourced cats from the Weber article, Toby. If you spot others, do the same. Be bold! --Orange Mike 19:54, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Ok Mike. Thanks. I have some other references that I will be adding to the Roberto DeLuna page. I respect your help to make me a better Wiki editor.. Tobyspinks 20:13, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

While Orangemike is totally correct (according to WP:BLP policy), I'd like to point out that the LGBT WikiProject is in the middle of researching (and making sure they're sourced) every LGBT person's article on wikipedia. Feel free to help out if you're looking for something to do :) -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 21:59, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Further inspection reveals that the article you cited does indeed out him - the first paragraph says "three quality solo exhibits by queer artists," and then it names him as one of the three. So that's a perfectly good source to have! -- SatyrTN (talk | contribs) 22:02, 29 August 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for your help! Cheers. Tobyspinks 04:53, 31 August 2007 (UTC)