Talk:Mary Sue

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The following references may be useful when improving this article in the future: Chander, Anupam; Sunder, Madhavi (2007). "Everyone's a Superhero: A Cultural Theory of 'Mary Sue' Fan Fiction as Fair Use". California Law Review. 95 (2): 597–626. doi:10.2307/20439103. ISSN 0008-1221. JSTOR 20439103. Chaney, Keidra; Liebler, Raizel (2006). "Me, Myself, and I: Fan Fiction and the Art of Self-Insertion" (PDF). Bitch. Vol. 31. Portland, Ore. pp. 53–57. ISSN 2162-5352. Anniversary issue. Frankel, Valerie Estelle (2020). "Rey, Maz, Rose, Leia, Holdo, and Phasma". Star Wars Meets the Eras of Feminism: Weighing All the Galaxy’s Women Great and Small. Lanham, Md.: Lexington Books. pp. 162–226. ISBN 978-1-4985-8387-9. Mackey, Margaret; Mcclay, Jill Kedersha (2008). "Pirates and poachers: Fan fiction and the conventions of reading and writing". English in Education. 42 (2): 131–147. doi:10.1111/j.1754-8845.2008.00011.x. ISSN 1754-8845. Prucher, Jeff, ed. (2007). "Mary Sue". The Oxford Dictionary of Science Fiction. Oxford University Press. ISBN 978-0-19-530567-8. Turk, Tisha (2011). "Metalepsis in Fan Vids and Fan Fiction" (PDF). In Kukkonen, Karin; Klimek, Sonja (eds.). Metalepsis in Popular Culture. Berlin: Walter de Gruyter. pp. 83–103. doi:10.1515/9783110252804.83. ISBN 978-3-11-025278-1.

This archetype is also known as The Omnicompetent Woman, the feminine form of The Omnicompetent Man. Both are descendants of the more classical Demi-God/dess archetype. --Studio 126 (talk) 18:05, 30 January 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Source? —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 19:31, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Villain Sues are counterpart of Mary Sues who do malicious deeds as a fictional canon villain. 136.158.59.157 (talk) 03:39, 1 May 2021 (UTC)[reply]

Source? —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 19:32, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I agree it's a good fit for the article to explain the phenomenon's history and origin, but surely the copyright is owned by Paula Smith or the Menagerie group. Heaven knows I'm no expert on copyright practice on WP, but I wouldn't say that "short quotations" at WP:COPYPASTE applies here. Or... maybe the fanzine was published under a free license, or the copyright has expired early? I wouldn't know, so that's why I'm asking.

And while on the subject... if the text is free to use, surely its illustration is too and can be included for this article? Just a thought. Gaioa (T C L) 07:56, 12 December 2022 (UTC)[reply]

Good point, I've removed the full-text transcription. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 19:28, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I suggest mentioning the protagonist of The Pursuit of Happyness (2006) as a Marty Stu character. He is a victim of undeserved misfortune which seriously impacts his life, but he does not seem to have any visible internal flaw.—Anita5192 (talk) 15:59, 2 July 2023 (UTC)[reply]

Is there an independent, published source that says as much? Otherwise this analysis would be original research. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 19:29, 2 March 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I've been reading sci-fi including fan fiction for over 30 years, me Da started back in the late 50's, early 60's. The Mary Sue characters certainly were not limited to the female gender, but they early on radiated out from the crowd, they were the most beautiful woman ever to be saved and could instantaneously use quantum mechanics to calculate how to save the planet. My dad talked about this many years before the term was coined.

The current article holds "Media-studies researcher Christine Scodari says there is a tendency within slash fandom to label major female characters such as Nyota Uhura in the 2009 film Star Trek as "Mary Sues", because of a perception that development of the female character takes away screen time from male characters."

I searched through academic source for expanded media studies research by Christine Scodari, I was left disappointed, this article implies some sort of gendered ideal behind Mary Sue. I don't have the understanding to improve this page properly but when it has "development of the female character takes away screen time from male characters", I know it is in desperate need of revision. BeardedChimp (talk) 03:12, 12 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Scodari is describing a perception among sci-fi fans, not the reality. Wikipedia articles are based on published, reliable sources such as Scodari (2012), not user's personal experiences. —Sangdeboeuf (talk) 15:57, 12 April 2024 (UTC)[reply]

You made this edit which makes a claim that doesn't appear to be based on published, reliable sources. Why do you hold others to standards which you yourself don't follow? The fixer man swag (talk) 12:33, 4 November 2024 (UTC)[reply]